Sparkey Posted August 22, 2017 Report Share Posted August 22, 2017 I don't have a new one. I received a Woodcraft catalog and they have a new scrollsaw for sale. It is made by King. It looks exactly like the Excaliber. The 16" is $599 and the 30" is $899. They didn't show anything in between those two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonylumps Posted August 22, 2017 Report Share Posted August 22, 2017 2 hours ago, Sparkey said: I don't have a new one. I received a Woodcraft catalog and they have a new scrollsaw for sale. It is made by King. It looks exactly like the Excaliber. The 16" is $599 and the 30" is $899. They didn't show anything in between those two. That is the only 2 sizes.You could only buy them on there web site There not in any of the stores yet.i swear thy are the exact saw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trailfndr Posted August 22, 2017 Report Share Posted August 22, 2017 They are the same saw. King bought out the com[any that built the Excalibur's, but part of the deal was to not use the Excalibur name. Its the same saw, built the same way, with the same parts, from all I have heard and can determine from my research Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tuner Posted August 22, 2017 Report Share Posted August 22, 2017 So we know the saws are most likely good, how are they on costumer service, Somebody get one and review it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWoodArtist Posted August 22, 2017 Report Share Posted August 22, 2017 49 minutes ago, tuner said: So we know the saws are most likely good, how are they on costumer service, Somebody get one and review it I don't know about the saw but like you say they are likely good. As for the customer service question. I would say the customer service is good as it's Woodcraft. I've dealt with Woodcraft for a long time. I just recently have had to do online ordering and phone ordering and question asking as the store that I use to use was destroyed in the Tornado that hit Tulsa, Oklahoma not to long ago. The shopping center it was in was wiped out and will have to be demolished. In the meantime the next closest one is in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma which is around 3 hours drive where the one in Tulsa was around 1 hour or so. I will make the trip for ply but not for things that are easily shipped. So far, so good on customer service as I've called them seems like once everyday or at least every other day. I got so use to just taking the drive when to get things and ask questions in person but not now and probably be that way for a while according to the Tulsa store's Facebook, they are looking at their options and locations available but will be back in Tulsa or in the area as soon as they can. Anyways, every question I have had no matter how stupid it was, they've answered them and gave me all the information I would ask for about things. Now I'm not sure what the other stores service will be like but would think they are pretty much the same as the OKC store and the Tulsa one was. I am just wishing and hoping they may end up having a damage sale on the tools they had in the Tulsa store. I've asked the OKC store about it but they can't answer that either way as right now they are still dealing with insurance. Anyways, hope this answers your questions. I'm looking to get one of the 30" saws soon. Would've gotten one by now but have had other things come up that have higher priority so the extra saw is on hold for a while. Plus I'm really looking to get a smaller saw to take to shows with me as right now I have an EX-21 and EX-30 and those are a little bulky to haul around but, may just use the 21" as my show saw and get another 30" for the shop. My shop is a two person shop as my wife helps in the shop and also works on her own projects so have to keep 2 saws in the shop able to be used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Monk Posted August 23, 2017 Report Share Posted August 23, 2017 I talked to the Woodcraft on line customer service. They said that they get dropped shipped from King. There is no service center in the US. That turned me off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrappile Posted August 23, 2017 Report Share Posted August 23, 2017 Humm, if it is exactly like the Excalibur as some say it is, you will be able to get parts from Seyco. I bet they will also help diagnose problems. But a person may be on there own replacing bad parts. I do not know of any parts on the Ex that are difficult to replace. But personally, I would make sure about all this info before I would purchase one a King saw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonylumps Posted August 23, 2017 Report Share Posted August 23, 2017 I know the Delaware store never herd about the King saw.They are now selling Hegner They made a deal with Advance They are the only ones in the USA that sell Hegner other than Advance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgman Posted August 23, 2017 Report Share Posted August 23, 2017 The Woodcraft store in Ventura, Ca. has them on the sales floor. Even though I have never used an EX, they look excactly like the Excalibur except for the branding.. I didn't have tine to test them as I stopped in between jobs and didn't have time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrappile Posted August 23, 2017 Report Share Posted August 23, 2017 SOMEONE who can please try one! If it is just like the Excalibur and at that price,,, DeWalt will be out of business... Seriously a saw as good as the Excalibur, at a cheaper price... just saying. I will be sorry I have a Seyco, and Seyco is in trouble also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucky2 Posted August 23, 2017 Report Share Posted August 23, 2017 I know nothing about the new King scroll saw, but I do know of the quality of most of their other types of woodworking tools. It's been years since I was stupid enough to spend any money on a King woodworking tool. From personal experience, I know just how poor the quality of their tools are. I've never had one of their tools last any length of time, every one that I bought I had to return for a refund. I knew the sales rep for King tools, and he personally guaranteed that he's make things right if I had an issue with their tools. Thank goodness he stood behind his word, because all of their tools were junk. The reason for buying them in the first place was the price, they were half the cost of their competitors. They used inferior quality materials in making their tools, it was east to tell after using the tool just a couple of times. I wonder if that is why or how they can offer these new saws ,at the low price they offer them up for. Personally, I'll never own another tool that is made by or for the King brand of tools, they are junk as far as I'm concerned. It is not only me who feels this way, ask most woodworkers who have dealt with King tools and they will tell you the same as I am. Len Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWoodArtist Posted August 23, 2017 Report Share Posted August 23, 2017 From what I've read on the web. They bought the company that made the EX and that company will be making these. If that's the case I would think they are going to be made of the same quality and such as the Ex was. My thinking anyways. We will see. If King is like most brands. They pay others to make their things and they just put their name on it and if that's the case it don't have necessary the brand that's bad just the company that made that particular tool. Take HF for example, from experience their cheaper tools are crap but take the commercial line they offer and the higher priced tools, they aren't bad like everyone makes them out to be. I know I have a shop full of them and even have the extended warranties on most just in case but on most the warranty has expired a while ago and still going strong with no problems. Now I'll have to admit they aren't like the higher priced brands as the adjustments and weight of these aren't as easy and as light as say Dewalt or others. Heck I even have somewhere in a box their $90 scroll saw and I used it for 3yrs and only reason I quit and boxed it up was because at that time they didn't have the adapters to go pinless and the way to use pinless blades that came with the saw well that's a cluster. It was going strong and imagine if I got it back out of the attic and unpacked it it would still go good. Just don't need it and don't want to invest in the adapters that are available online somewhere for it. So, the brand King won't scare me away by your experience with them. I was suppose to be able to demo one at the woodcraft store I frequent but, they are gone now because of the tornado that hit Tulsa a little while back and haven't went to the OKC one enough yet to get to know them. 3 hours is a little far to just go a lot compared to 1 to 1 1/2 hours to get to Tulsa. I'm doing a lot of online ordering from them now until I need more ply then I'll make the trip to OKC if they aren't open somewhere closer yet. The store in Tulsa building had to be demolished and they are still dealing with insurance and other things to know when or where they'll open back up but have promised they will be back within the area of Tulsa at least. I know Charles Hand stands by them he said he has 2 I believe but he got his through a Canadian distributor or King themselves as he is in Canada I believe I'm correct on that. He's the one that told me about the saw once I read where woodcraft was going to carry them now making them available in the US without have a large shipping and import charge. If I'm correct with him having 2 I trust his opinion to the point that he wouldn't steer you wrong. Or hasn't me yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucky2 Posted August 23, 2017 Report Share Posted August 23, 2017 What makes you think they can be built at the same quality level as the EX's were, but be sold at a much lower price? king is known to be inferior tool makers in Canada, most people who know tools won't even stop to look at a King tool. I would be willing to bet that the reason they can sell their saws cheaper, is because they are using lower quality components in their saws. They have in all of their other tools over the years, why not do the same in these new saws? To each their own, I just know that I will never own another King tool no matter what the price. Len Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonylumps Posted August 23, 2017 Report Share Posted August 23, 2017 Woodcraft would not take a chance on selling HF level of tools They sell Festool, Jet,Powermatic ,Laguna,why would they take a chance like that Birchbark 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark1 Posted August 23, 2017 Report Share Posted August 23, 2017 IMO, it's only a matter of time before someone gets their feelings hurt, the way this thread is going. It would be better to have a real review of the King saw that is based on fact. It is true that King doesn't have a sterling reputation, but without a review of the saw it's like bar talk. The thing I'm interested in is, What's the saw like? Any body actually see one? Own one? Mark WayneMahler and Scrappile 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrappile Posted August 23, 2017 Report Share Posted August 23, 2017 I totally agree with Mark. WayneMahler 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WayneG Posted August 23, 2017 Report Share Posted August 23, 2017 I have not pulled the trigger on buying an excelsior yet. I d informed by kms tools staff that the saw is exactly the same. Story goes according to him that King not only bought them out but also recruited and retained the fellow that was most responsible for the Excalibur design. I asked them how they could duplicate the saw exactly and not infringe on any patents, he stated that there are no patents involved at all.... I am trying to find someone who bought one here in Vancouver so I can discuss it with them... It's either excelsior new for me or a used hawk from across the border in Washington Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotshot Posted August 24, 2017 Report Share Posted August 24, 2017 (edited) I don't think King bought General unless something has changed very very recently. DMT Holding bought General a few years ago, then K&C AMERICA LLC (which is another holdings company) now own all the General trademarks, and presumably the company. Edited August 25, 2017 by hotshot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amazingkevin Posted August 25, 2017 Report Share Posted August 25, 2017 4 hours ago, hotshot said: I don't think King bought General unless something has changed very very recently. DMT Holding bought General a few years ago, then K&C AMERICA LLC (which is another holdings company) now own all the General trademarks, and presumably the company. So what is really going on? . . . How about a political situation that has caused incredible tension between China and Taiwan? The long time manufacturer is in Taiwan. Then in comes K@C America, backed by Chinese, run by Hua Zhang. Now we have a Chinese interest trying to get product from a Taiwan manufacturer, and bad blood ensues for a product that has most patents going back 20 years. . . . the point of expiration. This is a bad combination for General. This is the gist of the Chinese vs Taiwan theory that I heard seperately from two very different well known industry insiders (with some detail inserted from research). It sounded unbelievable when I first heard it, but I think the truth is some variation of this. On another front, I talked to a rep of Jet in Atlanta about the obvious EX design elements in their new scrollsaw, and that rep basically said they blatantly copied the EX design . . . which I think goes back to the expiring patents. I think the core DW788 patents are close to expiration also. Great info all of you ,Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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