Is the end near?

[zimmerstutzen]

Went to two craft shows in the past three weeks,  between the both, there were three folks with scroll work, except the edges were all dark as if charred.  All laser cut.  I saw no sales of their "work" which was little satisfaction.   Last time I saw real scroll work for sale, the owner was doing a brisk business and the things cut were tree slices so a bit hard to use a laser. anyway.  Fancy German style Schwibogen are going for $12.00 at Christmas Tree Shops because they are all mass produced laser cut in China.  

[kmmcrafts]

Funny you mention this.. I've turned a couple customers over to the laser made stuff since they wanted " perfect " work.. customer took 8-10 days to get back to me.. I got the order..and a big one too.. $500 worth.. 

There are tons of laser made stuff on etsy.. there are tons of other scroll sawers selling the same items as me on etsy.. yet I'm busy enough to turn work away.. done over $3000 in sales in the last 10 days... just on etsy.. 

Something a scroll sawer can do.. that a laser cant do very well....unless you have a very $$$ laser set up.. and that is stack cut.. While I am only one person.. and a guy with a shop full of lasers can run more per hour than I can.. I can out cut a single laser any day.. and I can have nice clean unburnt edges..  I could add a lot more to this list.. but I've got to get back out and cut orders... 

[tomsteve]

31 minutes ago, kmmcrafts said:

. 

Something a scroll sawer can do.. that a laser cant do very well....unless you have a very $$$ laser set up.. and that is stack cut.. While I am only one person.. and a guy with a shop full of lasers can run more per hour than I can.. I can out cut a single laser any day.. and I can have nice clean unburnt edges..  I could add a lot more to this list.. but I've got to get back out and cut orders... 

ive been to your etsy site and your work is top notch. lasers have a place and some people only care about price. however, there is a market that is growing again, which youre proving, for true handmade work and people will pay for that.

[tonylumps]

Last weekend I did a 2 Day event .Did really well Both days. BUT I overheard 2 conversations And they were accusing me of laser cutting.I almost lost it. But I calmed down and showed some of my pieces up close and the saw and sanding marks on them. I got a compliment out of one person.But they still did not buy .Oh well

[Fab4]

Hi Perry:
To answer your question
It would appear that the end is near for scrollsaw work
but for me personally I think laser sucks when used for scrollwork
 I'll be a scroller for as long I can
You just can't beat that feeling when a project is done and people appreciated your work
Fab4

[dgman]

I think you guys are way off the mark! There are many scrollsaw artist on this forum alone who are having great sales. Look at Iggy with his puzzles, and Kevin with his online sales, and Orangeman, and so on. I myself had banner sales this year! We do have to sell ourselves a little more, but that's ok. I too hear the laser mumblings  and quickly respond with a picture of me behind my scrollsaw. Do I think the end is near for scrollsaw work? No, the sky's the limit!

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

4 hours ago, dgman said:

I think you guys are way off the mark! There are many scrollsaw artist on this forum alone who are having great sales. Look at Iggy with his puzzles, and Kevin with his online sales, and Orangeman, and so on. I myself had banner sales this year! We do have to sell ourselves a little more, but that's ok. I too hear the laser mumblings  and quickly respond with a picture of me behind my scrollsaw. Do I think the end is near for scrollsaw work? No, the sky's the limit!

Depends on how much you want to believe. I never believe people when talking about sales and I try not to include them unless pushed. Many things do go into sales of any items and of course location is always #1 and #2. I have been doing this for over 30 years and I have seen the peeks and valleys and yes scrolling is down and never will be the same thing it once was and anyone here can twist their words any way they want but not going to be the same. One's person of doing well is not the same for everyone. Some people and I should say most people do this as well as turn pens which I have done for 10 years now do it for the hobby or joy and there are tons of threads on this. Selling online in various vendor sites such as Etsy is a crapshoot to say the least. If you can get a following then maybe you can make some money. If you do not have much competition will also help and that goes for shows as well. 

I will comment about the laser thing. It has always been an obstacle to us scrollers. It is a reason to try to do things that can not be copied by lasers but that is getting harder and harder. I posted a thread a few days ago about wanting to start a few new projects and one was the Military plaques. Well long and behold I found a couple sites that sell these exact plaques and are laser cut. Cutting records is another project I want to do this year and there are a ton of sites that do this by laser. Can not compete with this and that is another reason scrollers are fading away. Yes you may still do it but how many have given it up that you do not know about. Things like flat ornaments are probably the easiest things to do with lasers. It is an even bigger fight these days to continue with shows because of so many people buying on line. Joining the ranks of ebay, etsy and Amazon can and will lead to an overflow of product to choose from and thus price wars.

What are the answers, well that is for each of us to battle with on our own. Whatever it is you have to be the best salesperson you can possible be. You have to have quality products and that includes finishing. And you need the gift of gab. Good luck as you continue on and do not get discouraged until you have tried various methods and avenues.  It is a battle and not an easy one. Making our projects is the easiest part of the journey. 

[amazingkevin]

11 hours ago, zimmerstutzen said:

Went to two craft shows in the past three weeks,  between the both, there were three folks with scroll work, except the edges were all dark as if charred.  All laser cut.  I saw no sales of their "work" which was little satisfaction.   Last time I saw real scroll work for sale, the owner was doing a brisk business and the things cut were tree slices so a bit hard to use a laser. anyway.  Fancy German style Schwibogen are going for $12.00 at Christmas Tree Shops because they are all mass produced laser cut in China.  

I had a guy look at my work that runs a laser and says he can't tell the different in my work and a laser!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[kmmcrafts]

54 minutes ago, JTTHECLOCKMAN said:

Depends on how much you want to believe. I never believe people when talking about sales and I try not to include them unless pushed. Many things do go into sales of any items and of course location is always #1 and #2. I have been doing this for over 30 years and I have seen the peeks and valleys and yes scrolling is down and never will be the same thing it once was and anyone here can twist their words any way they want but not going to be the same. One's person of doing well is not the same for everyone. Some people and I should say most people do this as well as turn pens which I have done for 10 years now do it for the hobby or joy and there are tons of threads on this. Selling online in various vendor sites such as Etsy is a crapshoot to say the least. If you can get a following then maybe you can make some money. If you do not have much competition will also help and that goes for shows as well. 

I will comment about the laser thing. It has always been an obstacle to us scrollers. It is a reason to try to do things that can not be copied by lasers but that is getting harder and harder. I posted a thread a few days ago about wanting to start a few new projects and one was the Military plaques. Well long and behold I found a couple sites that sell these exact plaques and are laser cut. Cutting records is another project I want to do this year and there are a ton of sites that do this by laser. Can not compete with this and that is another reason scrollers are fading away. Yes you may still do it but how many have given it up that you do not know about. Things like flat ornaments are probably the easiest things to do with lasers. It is an even bigger fight these days to continue with shows because of so many people buying on line. Joining the ranks of ebay, etsy and Amazon can and will lead to an overflow of product to choose from and thus price wars.

What are the answers, well that is for each of us to battle with on our own. Whatever it is you have to be the best salesperson you can possible be. You have to have quality products and that includes finishing. And you need the gift of gab. Good luck as you continue on and do not get discouraged until you have tried various methods and avenues.  It is a battle and not an easy one. Making our projects is the easiest part of the journey. 

Depends on how much you want to believe. I never believe people when talking about sales and I try not to include them unless pushed. Many things do go into sales of any items and of course location is always #1 and #2  I don't think location is much of an issue selling online... Do you?

Selling online in various vendor sites such as Etsy is a crapshoot to say the least..  I'd say it really depends on how much effort you put into selling online no matter where you sell. I find it odd that people can downplay online selling especially when they know nothing about selling online.. 

can and will lead to an overflow of product to choose from and thus price wars. Guess you'll have to stay a step or two above the others.. do something different to stand out.. Personally I find that the majority of sellers online know nothing about internet marketing and SEO..  Like I've said many times.. doesn't matter what the prices are if nobody is seeing your web page.. ( My ornaments are selling about as fast as I can make them at $16 each... most of my competitors sell at $8 - 10 ).. Guess maybe I am a step above the others..as I've had classes on internet marketing and SEO..

I will comment about the laser thing. It has always been an obstacle to us scrollers..  Lasers probably do have some effect on scroll saw work.. but I find that most people that know very little about them seem to think that they just magically pop out products at a 100 pcs per hour or something.. You can scroll faster than a laser can cut.. most lasers cannot cut very thick material.. unless your talking about a $50,000+ laser.. then you have to sell the crap out of stuff just to pay for the laser.. not to mention that they do wear out just like any scroll saw would.. The affordable lasers for the crafter type people are lucky to be able to cut 1/8" material.. They do make great engravers or pyrography type stuff.. and are good for many other things.. but I don't see woodwork/ fretwork style stuff as being all that great at.. A CNC router is the same way.. great for carving.. not so good at actually cutting fretwork type stuff.. the router bits can only go down to a small diameter.. hard to get good sharp corners with a round bit that is still bigger than most scroll saw spiral blades.. That all said.. yes like I said in the beginning.. lasers probably do have an impact.. but I think there is room for both..as both have their limits..

I never sold anything craft wise 30 years ago.. so I don't know what selling was like back then.. My father tried his hand at selling his work.. Did a years worth of craft fairs back in 1989 - 1990.. only one show he made enough money to pay for the booth.. He told me one day to take all the stuff and hand it out to my brothers etc.. I took the stuff to work to show co-workers.. I ended up selling about everything he had within a week.. and had a couple orders for him if he wanted them.. when I gave him a wad of money he was like.. whats that for.. I told him I sold all his craft work... he couldn't believe it..  

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

Well Kevin being you took my reply apart I guess I am suppose to respond. You are correct about location and selling on line. That was not my intent there. Without going into all this stuff that gets brought up time and time again about how to sell and where to sell and what sells. Lets say everybody is different. Everyone approaches this differently. If I made the same things you make and sold on etsy right next to you but have a lower price than you I bet I put you out of business. People do look for bargains. They could not tell the difference between what I did and you did if we made the same things. Now maybe it comes down to description and how colorful and detailed one gets in explaining what they made. I say this with a big MAYBE because we never will know. Yes marketing yourself and your products is key to any sales weather on line or brick and mortar. That is a given. You get back what you put into something. But developing a following and repeat customers goes a long way too.This is again on line or at shows. 

Lasers yes there is room for both and as I said they have been around a long time. But people still do compare works but may not know what they are looking at. I stopped years ago trying to explain. I use to have a laser cut clock on my table to show folks the difference. You are wrong about time though. A laser can cut quite fast if program to do so. But what a scrollsaw will be able to do is stack cut which will out pace a laser. I have seen some of these in operation and they are sleek. 

 

As for the 30 years ago, if you were doing what you are now 30 years ago you would not have time to be on here. But you have to remember craft shows were the source, today multisales outlet has trump that. You did not sell on line back then. Do not know anything about your Dad so won't comment there but can tell you I did the show circuit. At least 12 shows a year and every show was a winner. But you had waiting lists to get into a show back then too. I have told my story here before. I also did the consignment thing for a few years with 6 stores in 3 top flight malls and did great. When the company changed hands things fell apart and I left that. I started woodworking back in the 70's.

My point in all this and to get to the OP's question, yes there is a change in the guard but it is not enough to not try to make a go of it. It is not lasers that are creating the change but the way we do business today. If you make some changes you too can keep up. For me my time has past. I been there done that but I have been around long enough to see the change as I mentioned. It was always nice to be able to talk to people and to talk up your work to live people. Now it takes descriptive words on a computer to make the sales. It to me is ashame that is where we have gone but it is the way of the world we live in.  Believe me I am not the only one seeing this. I have a ton of crafter friends in many different mediums and the same words are being used. Good luck is all I can say to all this. 

[lawson56]

Well I have been asked,did I use a Laser,CNC,even A Bandsaw?So I made a pic also of me and my saw even taped a blade to my cardholder.Most people are Amazed.

[kmmcrafts]

I guess maybe I mis-understood the original part of the topic.. I took it as.. "is the end near for selling scroll work" .. To that question.. NO... Maybe the way the crafts are being sold is changing.. and those that don't keep up with the times are at a loss.. Most all the craft shows around my area are a joke.. more like a flea market loaded with resellers.. even the one that is supposedly a high end show that is juried and cost $700 to get into.. with a waiting list.. it's a big joke... would I sell at one provided I could? Yes.. Do I want to? NO.. Hauling a set up to a show is not my idea of fun at all.. then packing back up the products I don't sell and bring them back home... I'm not one who likes being in a large crowd.. Much easier for me to make products.. and inventory the items ( or no inventory and just made items as ordered which is what I did this year ).. No sense in making inventory for items that might not sell real well.. Once the first one is made for the pictures.. I don't need to keep that inventoried.. 

Back when I first started selling my kids was much smaller and dependent on me.. doing craft shows wasn't an option.. that was something I was going to do once they were bigger... well.. now they are bigger.. and my online sales keep me busy enough to stay out of the shows.. so i don't really have the need or want....for doing the shows..