Hawk 226 Ultra Is Back Up And Running

[kmmcrafts]

Finally got a chance to order my parts I needed from Bushton on Monday.. parts came in the mail today.. I just came back in a short time ago after putting all new bearings etc. in 

Is it safe to say I wore out a brand new Hawk in 5 months.. bought the saw in May and replacing the bearings in it already..   Pretty sure it would have lasted much longer had the bearings actually had grease in them.. Not sure to blame that one on Hawk.. or China.. Bearings say Made in China.. Hawk says Made in the USA..   I picked up the bearings from a local bearing supply house.. The parts needed to complete my bearing job was the darn special spacer (washer) that goes in between the lower arm and the connecting rod.. I dropped the darn thing while trying to put it together last month.. I seen the general direction it took off to and i moved all the lumber around... never could find it.. now that is back together it'll show up, LOL

Needles to say.. she's got all brand new bearings ( with grease too  ).. and is running smoother than it ever has.. It's virtually smooth all through the gears until the very highest one.. she's got some vibration at top speed.. but used to have a pretty bad area right around the middle speed and would walk across the floor on just before high speed and up from there.. Hawk mailed me a paper with alignment instructions which one I had not thought of myself or tried.. which could have been part of the issue.. however no grease in the bearings I'm sure played a part too.. 

Now I need to put my new updated upper clamp / tension mechanism on my old Hawk 220.. the tension lever wouldn't stay down into the tension position.. guessing that's why that saw kept breaking blades.... This saw is one oldie as it doesn't have the small set screw to adjust to give it more tension.. so the whole new updated to the BM series style upper clamping system had to be used.. But since I am taking the arm off etc.. I also picked up new bearings etc for this one.. so if anything is bad or worn.. should be like new when I get this one done too..         

[lawson56]

Glad to read you got her back up and running.I know what it means to loose a small part.I have done it a few times.They have shown up when I sweeping the floor and no longer need them.

[stoney]

Kevin great to hear you have your bearing issues resolved and are back in business. 

[Rockytime]

On 1/20/2018 at 7:59 AM, stoney said:

Kevin great to hear you have your bearing issues resolved and are back in business. 

Hi Stoney. You said in another post you liked low maintenance things. So do I. That's why I love my Hegners. I've done a lot of mechanical work in my lifetime and loved it but not any longer at age 82. If I were younger I would add a Pegas to my shop. I like the color and I would do larger fret work being it is top feeder. I would also be capable of maintaining it but no longer. I could really care less what saw people use as long as it does what they want and are happy.  But what the heck do I know? Good conversation.

[stoney]

Hi Les, I agree with everything you said.  I'm 76 so not all that far behind you.  I used to do as much maintenance on things I've owned as I could but now find myself not all that interested in doing that anymore.   As far as scroll saws are concerned what ever gets the job done.   I will say I have had my Hegner since 2008 and haven't had to replace any parts yet, knock on wood.   The only maintenance required is oiling bushings and waxing table.  Oh and occasionally blowing off the sawdust. LOL

[Rockytime]

6 hours ago, stoney said:

Hi Les, I agree with everything you said.  I'm 76 so not all that far behind you.  I used to do as much maintenance on things I've owned as I could but now find myself not all that interested in doing that anymore.   As far as scroll saws are concerned what ever gets the job done.   I will say I have had my Hegner since 2008 and haven't had to replace any parts yet, knock on wood.   The only maintenance required is oiling bushings and waxing table.  Oh and occasionally blowing off the sawdust. LOL

Thumbs Up!

[OCtoolguy]

7 hours ago, stoney said:

Hi Les, I agree with everything you said.  I'm 76 so not all that far behind you.  I used to do as much maintenance on things I've owned as I could but now find myself not all that interested in doing that anymore.   As far as scroll saws are concerned what ever gets the job done.   I will say I have had my Hegner since 2008 and haven't had to replace any parts yet, knock on wood.   The only maintenance required is oiling bushings and waxing table.  Oh and occasionally blowing off the sawdust. LOL

When I had my Hegner, I did put some synthetic grease on the two pivot points at the rear of the arms. Where the triangular pivots contact the arm sockets. I figured that it sure couldn't do any harm since those two spots are in constant contact and rubbing when in motion.

 

[kmmcrafts]

3 hours ago, octoolguy said:

When I had my Hegner, I did put some synthetic grease on the two pivot points at the rear of the arms. Where the triangular pivots contact the arm sockets. I figured that it sure couldn't do any harm since those two spots are in constant contact and rubbing when in motion.

 

Hawk says to oil that wedge thing.. but I've read where someone said Hegner says not to.. I never could understand that theory but whatever.. Hawk doesn't have the brass bushings and there is no oil needed for the bearings in the arms at the pivot points.. so there is only oil on the cam lever area where you tension the blade at the front and that wedge at the rear of the saw.. 

I wish saw manufactures would put hour meters on the saws.. based on the amount of hours I run my saws since installing hour meters on them.. I'd say I have around 400 hours on the oldest 1993 Hawk I have.. it was well used and needed some parts when I first got it.. I have about $200 into that saw ( $100 I paid for the saw and $100 in parts ).. The Ultra was new when I got it in 2014 but it's a 1998 saw.. It needed two bearings shortly after I got it.. the grease dried up.. Anyway I'd say that saw has 600 hours by now.. other than those two bearings I've done nothing to it.. Newest Hawk had just turned 200 hours today.. The EX I'm guessing around 500 hours and about 300 hours is when I took it apart and cleaned / greased the bearings ( after it was too late LOL ) but I did manage to get another 100 hours before I had to buy new parts last summer and do that rebuild.. I just rolled the hours another 100 hours since that rebuild on it last week. so the saw has a total of 500 hours.. I've not had to do any repairs to the Hawks other than that one bearing in the ultra.. and the worn parts on the first Hawk but I bought that knowing it needed work. I'd say most of the DW - EX type saws should run 400 - 600 hours if they are not the China made ones.. But I really would be curious how many hours a Pegas etc type saw would run before needing bearings etc. since I had the China made saw I'm curious if one of the other better made ones would run longer without taking them apart for grease etc.. JT claimed ( and a few others on FB ) that they've never oiled the Hawk saw.. I know JT used to pump out a lot of work on his saws.. I bet they have over 2000 - 3000 hours.. Only thing he talked of having to replace was the tension cam mechanism a couple times.. That's really impressive to me.. considering never being oiled.  

I'm in no way trying to say Hawk is better than the other saws.. I'm basically stating my experience with Hawk and EX type saws based on my production cutting with each saw.. Not every saw in the same brand is going to be a great saw.. every brand has a lemon and I realize my EX was probably a lemon.. 

Edited January 26, 2021 by kmmcrafts

[Woodmaster1]

Whoa a brand new machine for parts. I hope it last longer than 5 months.

[kmmcrafts]

1 hour ago, Woodmaster1 said:

Whoa a brand new machine for parts. I hope it last longer than 5 months.

This post is 3 years old.. The saw was brand new still in the box Hawk that I bought in 2014-15? .. but the saw is actually a 1998.. sitting all those years the grease dried up in the two bearings the saw has that are greased bearings.. Replaced the bearings and 600 hours later still going strong.. Not bad for a $350 saw and $12 in bearings.. Produced around $60,000 -  70,000 in products with that saw. 

[GusGustin]

Kevin -- I have the 220vs also . . . love it. It's about 40 years old. Put 50 bucks worth of new parts on it about a month ago. But - have not put the new upper blade holder on yet. What did YOU use to knock that pin out, and, then put it back in. I don't want to damage that upper arm.

There's a young lady - about 63 or 64 - about 400 miles from me .. with a 26" model for sale .. pretty inexpensive. I'm thinking of taking the trip to meet her and get it.

What d'ya think. I have that Ridgid, the 220VS RBI and a Pegas. I like the 220vs better than the pegas.

So .... get the 26 incher ?

 

Gus

[kmmcrafts]

1 hour ago, GusGustin said:

Kevin -- I have the 220vs also . . . love it. It's about 40 years old. Put 50 bucks worth of new parts on it about a month ago. But - have not put the new upper blade holder on yet. What did YOU use to knock that pin out, and, then put it back in. I don't want to damage that upper arm.

There's a young lady - about 63 or 64 - about 400 miles from me .. with a 26" model for sale .. pretty inexpensive. I'm thinking of taking the trip to meet her and get it.

What d'ya think. I have that Ridgid, the 220VS RBI and a Pegas. I like the 220vs better than the pegas.

So .... get the 26 incher ?

 

Gus

You will need to use a pin punch.. https://www.harborfreight.com/8-piece-punch-set-93424.html  and firm but not too hard hits to push the pin out.. I actually soaked mine for a couple days with some PB blaster.. Hardest part is getting it to break loose from its spot.. once it moves it should go fairly easy. Then just kind of reverse the steps in putting it back in.. The pin should slide in with little effort.. but watch it to have the hole lined up as it pushes through when pushing the pin back in place.

I'm not to sure on the 26" saw.. I suppose it would depend exactly what style saw it is.. and what motor the saw has.. If the motor is a big bulky looking motor I'd pass it up.. If the motor is close to the diameter of the Pegas motor then I'd get it if you can justify the road trip etc..

The Hawks do cut nice and if I could only have one saw that'd be my choice.. Do like my Excalibur too.. just cut on the Hawks more but now and then I gotta change it up a bit and move to the Excalibur for a while.. Did that today actually.. I put about 2 hours on the Hawk and then switched over and did an hour on the Excalibur.. Sure like to have a Pegas.. They look cooler with the color scheme than my Excalibur, LOL

[GusGustin]

Kev .. I have the Pegas. I like the RBI better.  It has less vibration and I love setting the blade to be more or less aggressive. I could not believe .. when I called their tech support - told 'em - "I've just broken 7 Pegas 2/0 blades, just by throwing the tension lever over, and, not all the way, just where I'm supposed to" --- he says ---- I know. You have to lift up on the chuck a bit so that it doesn't stay to tight, just make it looser. Or, use a flying dutchmen. They don't seem to break in our chucks on that saw.

Oh man .. SERIOUSLY? Okay. So - now I only use the PEGAS 2/0's in the RBI. hahahahaha

 

[kmmcrafts]

9 hours ago, GusGustin said:

Kev .. I have the Pegas. I like the RBI better.  It has less vibration and I love setting the blade to be more or less aggressive. I could not believe .. when I called their tech support - told 'em - "I've just broken 7 Pegas 2/0 blades, just by throwing the tension lever over, and, not all the way, just where I'm supposed to" --- he says ---- I know. You have to lift up on the chuck a bit so that it doesn't stay to tight, just make it looser. Or, use a flying dutchmen. They don't seem to break in our chucks on that saw.

Oh man .. SERIOUSLY? Okay. So - now I only use the PEGAS 2/0's in the RBI. hahahahaha

 

Yeah that is one issue with the EX and Pegas type saws.. for those wanting to use the smaller blades.. Also be warned about those small blades with the NEW Hawks.. The older Hawks have a "soft start motor" they slow start and slowly ramp up to the speed you have set on the VS dial.. The new Hawks lack that feature and as soon as you hit the switch it's instantly at speed.. That sudden jolt can break those small blades.. I use 2/0 spirals in my new Hawk with no issue but can't really go any smaller than that without breaking a few now and then.. Just a heads up as I seen in another post you had talked to Bushton about the new saws.. They'd be perfect saw in my opinion if they brought back the slow start motor.. 

If I ever see a deal on a used Pegas or Hegner I'll buy one.. Already know the Pegas as it's basically the same as my Excalibur but never sat at a Hegner and they are good saws.. Could be my next new favorite saw when I wear out these three Hawks    

[OCtoolguy]

22 hours ago, GusGustin said:

Kevin -- I have the 220vs also . . . love it. It's about 40 years old. Put 50 bucks worth of new parts on it about a month ago. But - have not put the new upper blade holder on yet. What did YOU use to knock that pin out, and, then put it back in. I don't want to damage that upper arm.

There's a young lady - about 63 or 64 - about 400 miles from me .. with a 26" model for sale .. pretty inexpensive. I'm thinking of taking the trip to meet her and get it.

What d'ya think. I have that Ridgid, the 220VS RBI and a Pegas. I like the 220vs better than the pegas.

So .... get the 26 incher ?

 

Gus

Be aware that the 26 incher takes up a lot of space. That's why I sold mine. I have a very small shop. If you have room, no sweat. 

[Rockytime]

8 hours ago, kmmcrafts said:

Yeah that is one issue with the EX and Pegas type saws.. for those wanting to use the smaller blades.. Also be warned about those small blades with the NEW Hawks.. The older Hawks have a "soft start motor" they slow start and slowly ramp up to the speed you have set on the VS dial.. The new Hawks lack that feature and as soon as you hit the switch it's instantly at speed.. That sudden jolt can break those small blades.. I use 2/0 spirals in my new Hawk with no issue but can't really go any smaller than that without breaking a few now and then.. Just a heads up as I seen in another post you had talked to Bushton about the new saws.. They'd be perfect saw in my opinion if they brought back the slow start motor.. 

If I ever see a deal on a used Pegas or Hegner I'll buy one.. Already know the Pegas as it's basically the same as my Excalibur but never sat at a Hegner and they are good saws.. Could be my next new favorite saw when I wear out these three Hawks    

Hy Hegners have a slow start. The vacuum always comes on slightly before the saw. Much easier on machinery. Had it on my Bridgeport and lathe. My huge printing presses had slow start. Imagine your automobile, gas pedal to the floor and dropping the clutch. Something is gonna give!

[kmmcrafts]

4 hours ago, Rockytime said:

Hy Hegners have a slow start. The vacuum always comes on slightly before the saw. Much easier on machinery. Had it on my Bridgeport and lathe. My huge printing presses had slow start. Imagine your automobile, gas pedal to the floor and dropping the clutch. Something is gonna give!

Yeah for sure, That is probably my biggest peeve with the new Hawk I bought.. seems to be fine with most of the blades I use.. but does make me wonder if it's going to cause some sort of issue with the saw itself at some point, the other thing I dislike is the blade clamps are out in front of the angle adjuster which is convenient for blade changes but also drops the sawdust in your lap.. if you set close anyway, LOL The older saws you had to reach around behind to access the blade.. and the sawdust would pile up on the stand / base of the saw.. But that's the way most newer saws are anyway.. Excalibur, Pegas and DeWalts are that way anyway.. not sure about some of the others.. Hegners like that to probably? A lot of people hated how the Hawk you had to reach around behind that angle adjustment mechanism.. But I find that not to be an issue for me.. Rather be that way than have the sawdust pile in my lap and on the floor etc..