My biggest obstacles starting out.

[amazingkevin]

Was turning the corner in the corner with out overheating the blade and breaking it. I laugh now at how simple it was  and never even think be about it any more.  Travis years and years ago said to keep moving forward in the corners. Get in an out to keep from over heating the blade.

[don watson]

Thanks for that insight Kevin (and of course Travis)

[kmmcrafts]

I think that inside and outside sharp corners are probably one of the most common struggles most every scroller has. I have found a couple things that helped me was blade choice and speed of the saw. For years I used to saw up to the line for a inside corner and then back up slightly and shave another bit of wood off then turn.. I was using FD-UR blades at that time.. but with the blade design you have reverse teeth throughout the length of the blade so sharp corners are tough to do with them ( for me anyway ) A SR blade worked better.. but someone ( Mike who sold the blades ) told me to play around with saw speed, he thought I might need more saw speed.. I used to run the saw back in those days around half the speed on the dial.. I cranked it up to 3/4 and the corners was easier so I tried full speed and that worked for me.. I rarely turn a saw speed down these days.. what I had learned from that is that I was pushing the wood though too hard.. I like cutting a bit faster than many "maybe" because honestly I don't cut any faster but rather I just let the blade do the cutting.. Lot of people think saw speed is related to how fast you "have to cut" and it's not.. I get a cleaner cut on the edges, back side of the project etc.. by having saw speed fast and then just feeding the wood through it as fast as I'm comfortable to cut.. If you turn your saw speed up and it's cutting too fast it's not the saw.. it's "YOU" feeding it too fast.. you don't have to "shove" the piece through to keep up with the saw blade.. In turn you're letting the blade cut and clean itself out thus it's not running hot and burning the wood.. blades also last much longer when you're not "pushing" them through..

You can run the saw full speed in the middle of a kerf and not burn the wood.. If you have the wood getting burned it's not the saw speed or blade.. it's you pushing too fast for the blade to clean out the cut sawdust OR you're pushing off to one side or the other etc.. that blade can run all day in the kerf full speed so long as there is a slight gap around it.. once you push too hard or have it rubbing the side you get burns.. 

 

[Scrappile]

My daughter taught me how many years ago.. The worked  for a guy that sold the little plywood flags and thing the craft people bought to decorate.  Can't say why she worked two jobs for a while, might seem political. But she cut those little things and other things for about 4 hours every evening.  He got real fast at it and was good.  When I started scrolling she taught me how to do corners like that.  I'm still not as fast at it as she was.

[Eplfan2011]

I can totally relate to this, being a beginner I've struggled with it but didn't want to be "nibbling froever I sat down for a while with a couple of 12x12 scrap plywood pieces cutting lots of little squares untill it clicked.

 KKMCrafts thanks you have just improved my scrolling . Here I am trying to find the sweet spot for my Hawk and I just turn it up to full speed and concerntrate on My feed rate! and a lot of my problems corrected themselves.

 More topics like this one for us newbies ....lol

[CharleyL]

With experience, you will find that running at full speed causes your saw to wear out faster, and your blades to overheat and break faster. If your blades are turning blue, you are running the saw too fast, overheating the blade and making it dull and break faster. Tiny blade teeth can only remove the amount of wood that fits in their gullets. They have to clear this wood before they can cut any more wood. Scroll sawing is a journey, not a destination. Enjoy the journey, cutting as accurately and cleanly as you can. Treat project completion as a surprise and not something that is a race to get there. There is always another project more interesting than the past, so enjoy the journey, and then the next journey. Take care of your saw and it will last through many journeys. Beat the stuffing out of it and you will be complaining about what a lousy saw it was in a year or two, when it should have lasted 10 or more years. If you drive your car at it's maximum speed, it won't last long either.

Charley

[kmmcrafts]

50 minutes ago, CharleyL said:

With experience, you will find that running at full speed causes your saw to wear out faster, and your blades to overheat and break faster. If your blades are turning blue, you are running the saw too fast, overheating the blade and making it dull and break faster. Tiny blade teeth can only remove the amount of wood that fits in their gullets. They have to clear this wood before they can cut any more wood. Scroll sawing is a journey, not a destination. Enjoy the journey, cutting as accurately and cleanly as you can. Treat project completion as a surprise and not something that is a race to get there. There is always another project more interesting than the past, so enjoy the journey, and then the next journey. Take care of your saw and it will last through many journeys. Beat the stuffing out of it and you will be complaining about what a lousy saw it was in a year or two, when it should have lasted 10 or more years. If you drive your car at it's maximum speed, it won't last long either.

Charley

You are one of the folks of many on here that I really respect your advice and comments but I would disagree with this one.

If your blades turn blue it's because of 

a. you're pushing to hard through the piece

b. blade tension too loose allowing blade to flex enough to touch the sides of the wood

c. you're pushing the wood off to one side or the other

You should be able to saw at a slow speed and make a kerf.. back up slightly and turn your saw up to full speed and hold the board in the same spot so it doesn't tough the wood sides.. that blade could set there and run all day without burning the wood.. run that test and see if that's true.. you don't need to run it all day as that'd be boring but you get the idea.. only takes a few seconds to burn the blade or wood when it's at full speed.. Can't think of his last name but Mike ( that used to own the Mikesworkshop Flying Dutchman scroll saw blades sales site that supplied blades to many of us up until he passed ) is the one that told / taught me this.. Of coarse.. the saw being very well tuned will also make a difference.. If you have the blade in the top clamp off to the left side and the one in the bottom clamp off the the right side that blade gonna touch the wood as it moves.. Why tuning a saw is very important, that blade needs to be going straight up / down.. 

I also would disagree with the theory of the saw wearing out faster.. It's nothing like a car where a car has a combustion engine.. therefore the engine isn't always running 100% clean.. a combustion doesn't fully fire and burn off every bit of the fuel and the oil gets contaminated either through that or contaminates through the air intake system.. all this happens whether you run 600rpm or 6000rpm.. at the higher rpm it of coarse sucks in more air and fires more fuel in the given time hour / miles etc. A better analogy might be a wheel bearing.. that wheel bearing gonna go however many miles it's going to go whether it's going 10mph or 100mph.. doesn't matter to the bearing. Now there are other factors with a wheel bearing if you want to get tech about it like thrust from cornering etc.. but assuming its just going straight like the scroll saw blade should be fed straight..

At the end of the day.. if one is more efficiently cutting with the saw at full speed rather than half speed the important thing is what works easier and more efficient for the person sitting / standing at the saw.. whether it's slow speed or fast speed you have to do you.. That being said Mike worked with me through emails and helped me find that I was running the saw too slow.. You can burn by running too fast or too slow.. you just have to relax and let the blade do the work.. Full speed may not work for everyone.. as does the slowest speed. When you get experience with relaxing and letting the blade do the work and controlling the speed by how fast you feed the wood to the blade that saw can run at full speed without burning the wood.. 

With the tight corners that everyone seems to struggle with in the beginning.. the issue is if the saw is running slow and you turn the corner too fast you're heating the blade.. a very common issue with the struggle as to me it's pretty hard to turn those corners at the very slow speed.. with the faster speed the blade actually cuts the corner better as it's running faster.. either case if you're good at doing the corners slow then don't speed up the saw.. but if you're struggling then try playing with saw speed.. Mike told me most folks don't run the saw fast enough so he was the one to have me speed up the saw for those dreaded corners.. It worked for me.. may not for others as everyone is different..  

 

[Eplfan2011]

I'm thinking out loud here so please don't take any thing said personally it's just the way my brain works

I may be over thinking this but wouldn't a blade running at 750spm remove the same proportionate amount of chips as a blade running at 1500spm being as it's making 2 strokes to the others one?

I'm inclined to think whatever speed the blades running the amount of of pressure applied to the wood your cutting would dictate the speed of cut.

If the wood does not touch the blade no cutting occurs and the blade stays cool. The more pressure applied to the blade the faster the cut and the more heat is generated untill it reaches it maximum rate of cut when as stated it cannot clear chips fast enough.

Just my logic and it may be wrong but it makes sense to me as with all things it's down to personal preference and whatever works for you.

[OCtoolguy]

I'm not going to take either side. What I will say is that first of all, my saws, none of them, run as smoothly at full speed. The vibration factor enters in and that in itself disturbs me and I don't feel as much in control. I usually find that sweet spot where my saw is running as fast as possible without going into what I call the "shake zone". I try to let the blade do the work and follow along at my comfortable pace. I'm not in this hobby for speed. I'm in it for relaxation and enjoyment. I do not enjoy trying to "keep up" with the saws speed. I've learned how to make the sharp corners by relaxing the forward pressure and transferring that pressure to the back side of the blade while at the same time turning the work piece. Another thing I've learned is that "muscle memory" goes away very quickly. If I am not cutting on a semi-daily basis, I lose some of the memory and so I always warm up with a practice piece just to get everything working again.

 

[Eplfan2011]

1 hour ago, OCtoolguy said:

I'm not going to take either side. What I will say is that first of all, my saws, none of them, run as smoothly at full speed. The vibration factor enters in and that in itself disturbs me and I don't feel as much in control. I usually find that sweet spot where my saw is running as fast as possible without going into what I call the "shake zone". I try to let the blade do the work and follow along at my comfortable pace. I'm not in this hobby for speed. I'm in it for relaxation and enjoyment. I do not enjoy trying to "keep up" with the saws speed. I've learned how to make the sharp corners by relaxing the forward pressure and transferring that pressure to the back side of the blade while at the same time turning the work piece. Another thing I've learned is that "muscle memory" goes away very quickly. If I am not cutting on a semi-daily basis, I lose some of the memory and so I always warm up with a practice piece just to get everything working again.

 

Ray, no sides to be taken lol

My last comment may have been misunderstood, for clarity I was trying to say that regardless of the speed of the blade slow or fast the biggest factor of how fast the blade cuts is the pressure on the work peice. That said even if the saw is running fast I'm feeding slowly, I'm not trying to keep up with it I'm just giving the blade as much as I feel comfortable handling, maybe because I'm new to this having the blade running fast forces me to concerntrate on My feed rate.... I don't know I'm a rank armature at this but so far it seems to be working for me. Please forgive me for breaking all the scroll saw rules

[kmmcrafts]

My Hawk runs at 1750 spm.. I don't usually run it full speed.. probably closer to 1500 spm.. My Excalibur runs 1550 or maybe it's 1500 anyway I run that one full speed. My old DW788 run 1700.. I run it most times full speed. The Hawk does pick up a slight vibration at full speed and I've never really "tuned" it for running full speed.. other saws that had picked up vibration at full speed I typically play around with the stand to make it have the vibration free at the speed I like.. You can adjust that "sweet spot" by fooling with the saws stand usually.. I say i run my saws full speed but in reality it's around 1500 spm for those saws that run faster than the 1500 I run it close to that unless it's really smooth at full speed.

The point I'm trying to get across is just because the saw is running full speed doesn't mean you "have to cut faster" YOU control the feed rate of the material.. On straight cuts you can go as fast as you like within reason for the blade to keep up.. when you get to those tight corners and turns the saw speed needs to be faster ( for me anyway ) as those tight turns are hard to do slow enough for the blade to not heat up.. so running the saw faster the blade is able to "cut" the corner without burning the corner or heating the blade. 

Too many people ( I think dang near everyone ) that scroll saw run the saw slow because they cannot keep up with the cut and loose control.. when in reality your just feeding the blade because you're "used to pushing" it through.. relax and let the blade do it's work.. Running the saw faster makes blades actually last longer for me.. This may not work for you.. maybe you need practice in relaxing rather than shoving the material into the blade too hard. This is a point I've mention many of times on here and only one other person ( Jim ) says the same thing.. he like to run the saw fast too and says this same thing.. 

It has always kind of irritated me because I'm a "production scroller" ( business ) folks think I'm running a race of some sort.. not that at all.. It's just what FD Mike taught me to do and it works if you try it.. It does take some practice.. Kinda like when front wheel drive cars came out.. on slick roads you go into a bit of a slide you hit the gas peddle and the front wheels will pull you in the direction you have them in.. rear wheel drive is the opposite let off the gas peddle.. Seems weird to hit the gas instead.. same with the saw.. sharp corner = more speed.. you feel like you should slow down but nope.. speed the saw up and let the blade do the work.. guide the piece through not shove it through.. 

 

EDIT: Pay attention to the blade.. on a long straight cut stop feeding the material from time to time.. If you're flexing the blade you're pushing too hard and either need more blade speed or relax.. eventually playing with blade speed and feed rates over time you'll learn what works better for you.. I think most every scroll sawer feeds the blade too fast based on the comments on these post like this.. Like I say.. YOU are in control of how fast you cut.. not the saw.. though the saw does limit you based on speed. 

 

Edited September 15, 2022 by kmmcrafts

[Lucky2]

Mike Moorlach, was the owner of Flying Dutchman Blades, he was one of the best resources that there ever was, when it came to scroll saws and their blades. I did a lot of dealings with Mike, he allowed me to sell Flying Dutchman Blades here in Canada. Mike was a wonderful person, he had time for anyone even if it wasn't about saw blades. He was an open book, plus he was very interesting to talk to. He would freely talk about WWll, some of the horror stories he had were so sad. And nearly unbelievable, every so often he would have to stop talking about it, it was quite upsetting for him at times. But then, on other occasions he would go on forever, without being asked. It was a very sad day for me when Mike passed away, he was a great friend and person I am pleased to have known him. Wooden Teddy Bear bought him out, and they still sell Flying Dutchman Blades through what was Mike's site. 

Len

[amazingkevin]

On 9/14/2022 at 8:22 AM, kmmcrafts said:

I think that inside and outside sharp corners are probably one of the most common struggles most every scroller has. I have found a couple things that helped me was blade choice and speed of the saw. For years I used to saw up to the line for a inside corner and then back up slightly and shave another bit of wood off then turn.. I was using FD-UR blades at that time.. but with the blade design you have reverse teeth throughout the length of the blade so sharp corners are tough to do with them ( for me anyway ) A SR blade worked better.. but someone ( Mike who sold the blades ) told me to play around with saw speed, he thought I might need more saw speed.. I used to run the saw back in those days around half the speed on the dial.. I cranked it up to 3/4 and the corners was easier so I tried full speed and that worked for me.. I rarely turn a saw speed down these days.. what I had learned from that is that I was pushing the wood though too hard.. I like cutting a bit faster than many "maybe" because honestly I don't cut any faster but rather I just let the blade do the cutting.. Lot of people think saw speed is related to how fast you "have to cut" and it's not.. I get a cleaner cut on the edges, back side of the project etc.. by having saw speed fast and then just feeding the wood through it as fast as I'm comfortable to cut.. If you turn your saw speed up and it's cutting too fast it's not the saw.. it's "YOU" feeding it too fast.. you don't have to "shove" the piece through to keep up with the saw blade.. In turn you're letting the blade cut and clean itself out thus it's not running hot and burning the wood.. blades also last much longer when you're not "pushing" them through..

You can run the saw full speed in the middle of a kerf and not burn the wood.. If you have the wood getting burned it's not the saw speed or blade.. it's you pushing too fast for the blade to clean out the cut sawdust OR you're pushing off to one side or the other etc.. that blade can run all day in the kerf full speed so long as there is a slight gap around it.. once you push too hard or have it rubbing the side you get burns.. 

As usual you are on point !!!

 

[amazingkevin]

As usual you are on point again!!!

[amazingkevin]

On 9/14/2022 at 4:21 AM, don watson said:

Thanks for that insight Kevin (and of course Travis)

Thanks for looking,Don!!!

[amazingkevin]

On 9/14/2022 at 10:44 AM, Scrappile said:

My daughter taught me how many years ago.. The worked  for a guy that sold the little plywood flags and thing the craft people bought to decorate.  Can't say why she worked two jobs for a while, might seem political. But she cut those little things and other things for about 4 hours every evening.  He got real fast at it and was good.  When I started scrolling she taught me how to do corners like that.  I'm still not as fast at it as she was.

We're still always in the learning stages,lol

[amazingkevin]

On 9/14/2022 at 11:08 PM, Eplfan2011 said:

I can totally relate to this, being a beginner I've struggled with it but didn't want to be "nibbling froever I sat down for a while with a couple of 12x12 scrap plywood pieces cutting lots of little squares untill it clicked.

 KKMCrafts thanks you have just improved my scrolling . Here I am trying to find the sweet spot for my Hawk and I just turn it up to full speed and concerntrate on My feed rate! and a lot of my problems corrected themselves.

 More topics like this one for us newbies ....lol

Good to hear what worked for you,Epifan!!!

[amazingkevin]

On 9/15/2022 at 5:29 PM, kmmcrafts said:

My Hawk runs at 1750 spm.. I don't usually run it full speed.. probably closer to 1500 spm.. My Excalibur runs 1550 or maybe it's 1500 anyway I run that one full speed. My old DW788 run 1700.. I run it most times full speed. The Hawk does pick up a slight vibration at full speed and I've never really "tuned" it for running full speed.. other saws that had picked up vibration at full speed I typically play around with the stand to make it have the vibration free at the speed I like.. You can adjust that "sweet spot" by fooling with the saws stand usually.. I say i run my saws full speed but in reality it's around 1500 spm for those saws that run faster than the 1500 I run it close to that unless it's really smooth at full speed.

The point I'm trying to get across is just because the saw is running full speed doesn't mean you "have to cut faster" YOU control the feed rate of the material.. On straight cuts you can go as fast as you like within reason for the blade to keep up.. when you get to those tight corners and turns the saw speed needs to be faster ( for me anyway ) as those tight turns are hard to do slow enough for the blade to not heat up.. so running the saw faster the blade is able to "cut" the corner without burning the corner or heating the blade. 

Too many people ( I think dang near everyone ) that scroll saw run the saw slow because they cannot keep up with the cut and loose control.. when in reality your just feeding the blade because you're "used to pushing" it through.. relax and let the blade do it's work.. Running the saw faster makes blades actually last longer for me.. This may not work for you.. maybe you need practice in relaxing rather than shoving the material into the blade too hard. This is a point I've mention many of times on here and only one other person ( Jim ) says the same thing.. he like to run the saw fast too and says this same thing.. 

It has always kind of irritated me because I'm a "production scroller" ( business ) folks think I'm running a race of some sort.. not that at all.. It's just what FD Mike taught me to do and it works if you try it.. It does take some practice.. Kinda like when front wheel drive cars came out.. on slick roads you go into a bit of a slide you hit the gas peddle and the front wheels will pull you in the direction you have them in.. rear wheel drive is the opposite let off the gas peddle.. Seems weird to hit the gas instead.. same with the saw.. sharp corner = more speed.. you feel like you should slow down but nope.. speed the saw up and let the blade do the work.. guide the piece through not shove it through.. 

 

EDIT: Pay attention to the blade.. on a long straight cut stop feeding the material from time to time.. If you're flexing the blade you're pushing too hard and either need more blade speed or relax.. eventually playing with blade speed and feed rates over time you'll learn what works better for you.. I think most every scroll sawer feeds the blade too fast based on the comments on these post like this.. Like I say.. YOU are in control of how fast you cut.. not the saw.. though the saw does limit you based on speed. 

 

Interesting explanation!!!