Blades breaking

[Robert R]

I'm frustrated, for the last month I've been cutting up a storm.  At least a project a day and sometimes two. Small but just things to get use to cutting.  Today, all of a sudden I'm breaking blades, I don't even get 6", yes I'm doing small semi circles, they are the hardest so far for me. But not like I haven't done some already.  I checked to make sure the arm was parallel with the table, I took out the thumbscrews made sure all was clean so far the blades are not just coming out of the jaws they are breaking.  Six of them already. I've tried to lower the arm just a bit to make sure the blade was secured in the thumbscrew completely. I'm using a #2 blade, which I've been using off and on for the last two or three weeks.  I'll put in a #3 tomorrow just to see what it does.

I must be doing something wrong, so I'm looking for suggestions.  This is the first this issue has come up sense I got the machine. Oh, same batch of blades as well.

[rafairchild2]

Slow down the speed of the blade.

Make sure your blade is at 90 degrees to the table. Sides and back/front.

Make sure you are not tensioning it too tight.  Pluck to hear a high "C".

By the same token make sure your blade is not tensioned to loose.  No more than an 1/8th inch give when pushing your finger on the side.

Do not push too hard.  Feed the wood like you normally do, then just stop.  Watch the blade, does it seem like you had pushed it back or to the side if it moves back to neutral position?

[Robert R]

9 hours ago, rafairchild2 said:

Make sure you are not tensioning it too tight.  Pluck to hear a high "C".

By the same token make sure your blade is not tensioned to loose.  No more than an 1/8th inch give when pushing your finger on the side.

OK, so I did two out of the five as I already felt good about the other three and I have not had a problem today.   So unless something else comes up - thank you

[OCtoolguy]

Same type/thickness of wood?

[Robert R]

Yes sir, using ⅛" ply have not had any blowouts lately.

 

[Wichman]

where are the blade breaking? at the top clamp. the bottom clamp, the middle, or various?

[Robert R]

all of them about 2" up from bottom

 

[OCtoolguy]

7 hours ago, Robert R said:

Yes sir, using ⅛" ply have not had any blowouts lately.

 

Wow! 1/8" you can cut with sewing thread. Something is wrong. 2/0 should even work well. I think you're just over-tensioning. 

[Robert R]

The first blade I put in that afternoon, yes, I over tensioned it for sure, as it broke as I put the lever over. But I then paralleled the upper arm to the table and started again with the same results, so I lessened the tension a bit more and still 2 more times it broke.  That was when I got frustrated.  Granted the next day I had no more problem with it, but..... I went to a #3 blade and have not tried the #2 again, I should go try that and see what happens.

[FrankEV]

#2/0 blades will break if you look at them funny

Tensioning is the problem.   I do not play with my tensioning knob.  I keep it set whehe I have found it works for all blades, and it is taped in place because it tends to want to adjust itself.  

For #2/0 blade, after threading it through the dill hole being very careful not to kink it as that will cause it to break quickly also, I hold the blade slightly bent between my thumb and forefinger while tightening the top clamp.  This causes the blade to be a little longer between the clamps.  Then, while fliping the tensioning lever, I "feel" to make sure there is not too much tension and will stop if it "feels" tooooo tight.  This feel takes  practice and experimenting with, but it does work (at least for me).   You just can not, and it is not needed to, tension a 2/0 blade as tight as larger blades.   Also, I'm hard of hearing so the plucked "ping" just does not work for me.

If the blade does not break while fliping the tensioning lever over, it should be OK if you don't push too hard or run the saw at too high a speed.  And ,of course, 2/0 blades do not like to be turned in corners.  I use the double cut method to make a neat sharp inside point, creating a space in the work that you can turn the work without twisting the blade.  

I find both small regular and spiral blades break most often because they get kinked during the threading task.  Tiney holes for small blades are great if doing vaining or the like, but a litter bigger hole makes threading without kinking much easier.

All above just my 2 cents, for what it's worth. 

[kmmcrafts]

Are you using spiral blades or flat / straight blades.. I've broke spirals before but I don't really recall ever breaking a flat blade.. I'd say tension is the issue if you're talking about a real small blade but you mentioned a #2. Did you mean 2/0? 

I'm asking specifics because any #2 blade shouldn't break very easy and especially when just applying tension. The only time I did break some blades of this size was due to a bad batch of blades slipping past quality control.. a note to my supplier turned out to be a known issue with many complaints and replacement blades were mailed to me.. SO with that said it can be a blade quality issue and nothing to do with the saw or its user.. I have seen this with both Flying Dutchman and Pegas blades from time to time over the 20 ish years I've been scrolling.. 

[Wichman]

In no particular order I would:

Contact your blade source and see if there is a bad batch that they know about

check the linkage  on your saw and see if anything is binding (If a pivot point binds the blade tension can release just long enough for the blade to kink and then break)

check to see if the tension is being held. Run the saw for 10 to 15 seconds and then check the tension again (plucking). If the tension is not being held, that a whole nother discussion.

[OCtoolguy]

4 hours ago, Robert R said:

The first blade I put in that afternoon, yes, I over tensioned it for sure, as it broke as I put the lever over. But I then paralleled the upper arm to the table and started again with the same results, so I lessened the tension a bit more and still 2 more times it broke.  That was when I got frustrated.  Granted the next day I had no more problem with it, but..... I went to a #3 blade and have not tried the #2 again, I should go try that and see what happens.

Back off your tension knob a bit more and don't try taking the slack out of the mechanism. I usually pull down on the upper blade clamp when applying the tension lever and I was breaking blades too. I stopped doing that with the small blades and my breakage went way down. 

[OCtoolguy]

2 hours ago, FrankEV said:

#2/0 blades will break if you look at them funny

Tensioning is the problem.   I do not play with my tensioning knob.  I keep it set whehe I have found it works for all blades, and it is taped in place because it tends to want to adjust itself.  

For #2/0 blade, after threading it through the dill hole being very careful not to kink it as that will cause it to break quickly also, I hold the blade slightly bent between my thumb and forefinger while tightening the top clamp.  This causes the blade to be a little longer between the clamps.  Then, while fliping the tensioning lever, I "feel" to make sure there is not too much tension and will stop if it "feels" tooooo tight.  This feel takes  practice and experimenting with, but it does work (at least for me).   You just can not, and it is not needed to, tension a 2/0 blade as tight as larger blades.   Also, I'm hard of hearing so the plucked "ping" just does not work for me.

If the blade does not break while fliping the tensioning lever over, it should be OK if you don't push too hard or run the saw at too high a speed.  And ,of course, 2/0 blades do not like to be turned in corners.  I use the double cut method to make a neat sharp inside point, creating a space in the work that you can turn the work without twisting the blade.  

I find both small regular and spiral blades break most often because they get kinked during the threading task.  Tiney holes for small blades are great if doing vaining or the like, but a litter bigger hole makes threading without kinking much easier.

All above just my 2 cents, for what it's worth. 

I agree 100% with everything you said. You are more eloquent than I am.

[Robert R]

OK, so I just came in from 30. minutes of cutting arcs, circles, lines to no where, and the #2 didn't even falter.  I tried to do much of the tensioning that was mentioned here. I did not know if I was doing it right, but it works and I'm not changing the tensioning knob at all now.

Thanks

[OCtoolguy]

2 minutes ago, Robert R said:

OK, so I just came in from 30. minutes of cutting arcs, circles, lines to no where, and the #2 didn't even falter.  I tried to do much of the tensioning that was mentioned here. I did not know if I was doing it right, but it works and I'm not changing the tensioning knob at all now.

Thanks

I don't recall that you answered Kevin's question regarding blade size. Are you using 2/0 or #2? Big difference.

 

[Robert R]

12 hours ago, kmmcrafts said:

Are you using spiral blades or flat / straight blades.. I've broke spirals before but I don't really recall ever breaking a flat blade.. I'd say tension is the issue if you're talking about a real small blade but you mentioned a #2. Did you mean 2/0? 

I'm asking specifics because any #2 blade shouldn't break very easy and especially when just applying tension. The only time I did break some blades of this size was due to a bad batch of blades slipping past quality control.. a note to my supplier turned out to be a known issue with many complaints and replacement blades were mailed to me.. SO with that said it can be a blade quality issue and nothing to do with the saw or its user.. I have seen this with both Flying Dutchman and Pegas blades from time to time over the 20 ish years I've been scrolling.. 

kmmcrafts, no I wasn't using spiral blades, flat yes, and sorry I didn't mention it I was using 2/0.  Thanks for the help

[kmmcrafts]

On 6/30/2023 at 1:01 AM, Robert R said:

kmmcrafts, no I wasn't using spiral blades, flat yes, and sorry I didn't mention it I was using 2/0.  Thanks for the help

This might help.. I wasn't sure what saw you have but I thought I seen somewhere you had a Pegas style saw.. If so this might help.. Unfortunately some of these newer saws don't really have a variable tension like the older versions did.. which in turn is a confusing struggle for newbies.. 

I hope you find something useful from this.

 

[Robert R]

10 hours ago, kmmcrafts said:

This might help.. I wasn't sure what saw you have but I thought I seen somewhere you had a Pegas style saw.. If so this might help.. Unfortunately some of these newer saws don't really have a variable tension like the older versions did.. which in turn is a confusing struggle for newbies.. 

I hope you find something useful from this.

 

Yes, I have a Pegas 21. I have already tried the method in the video. I was surprised to find the blade still tight enough after tensioning it.  When his blade broke in the video, that was exactly what I was having. 

Thank you sir, much appreciated.

 

[crupiea]

Whenever i get like this with constant blades breaking i look at myself as the problem. 

Maybe just a tiny bit in a rush or something.  I will take a step back and give it a half hour or so and try again.  Oddly it usually fixes the problem. 
 

Not saying this is your issue but worth a try. 

[Robert R]

I gave it until the next morning 

[OCtoolguy]

This is sort of what I ended up doing but not to quite this extreme. I just stopped pulling down on the upper arm to take the slack out of the mechanism. I still broke some blades though so this might be what I will do in the future. I had no idea that it was okay to use the blade this loose prior to tensioning. I'm so used to working with #5 blades. I had no experience with these tiny blades so it was a learning situation for sure. Now, I know better. Thanks for posting this video.

[Robert R]

Ray, I didn't notice I was even pulling down on the upper arm until you mentioned it earlier, I think my problem has been solved with several great posts.

Thank you all