Vibration?

[James E. Welch]

Does everyone's saw have a spot in the speed adjustment where vibration is worse? I've gotten almost all the vibration out by bracing and supporting and while it's minimal, there's still a spot right around 3/4 speed that vibrates more than any other speed. Once past this spot it's still again. Through many adjustments I've gotten this spot to as small of a spot as I can and all and all I'm very happy with it. I'm just wondering if everyone has this spot in their speed adjustment. It's almost like it's the perfect harmonics in this one unsweet spot. 

 

[rafairchild2]

I have a newer 21" Excalibur, and it is the same thing at about 80% or so. But I find there are one or two "chattering" spots in the speed.  Harmonics might be the reason.

I usually find I like working at lower speeds so it is not an issue with me.  Before I got my Pegas chuck, I would get slight vibration at around 60-70%, above that it is annoying at different spots.

[OCtoolguy]

I think we can all agree that every scroll saw has some vibration. It's just the nature of the beast. Both of my Ex's are very smooth running saws but they each have a spot that is not good to use. I have never run any of my saws wide open because to me, it's just not comfortable. I am usually just under 3/4.

 

[Scrappile]

Even on my Hegner, there are sweet spots and there are not so sweet spots... I found that on all the scroll saw I have own, except the Craftsman it did not have any "sweet spots".  That puppy was all "Not so sweet spots", but I got scrolling done on it.  I have not bolted my Hegner stand to the floor, I have the bolts, may do it one day, probably the day before we move...

Edited July 4, 2023 by Scrappile

[Oldmansbike]

My old Hawk will vibrate if I turn it all the way up but I never cut up that high so it’s not a problem for me.

[James E. Welch]

I'm glad you guys understand what I meant. I wasn't sure if it came across right. I wasn't complaining. I'm happy with my saw. There's just a little spot where it vibrates more. I was just curious if this was the same for everyone. 

[Scrappile]

Resonance frequency?

[James E. Welch]

 

10 minutes ago, Scrappile said:

Resonance frequency?

This is the wording I was looking for. Is that what it is? Might be. It's a small window between 70% and 80% or so. Then it's great again. I just work below or above that speed. Not a big deal at all. Just a peculiar thing that I wondered about. Sometimes it's good to ponder. Lol  

[Scrappile]

Should have wrote Resonance frequencies,  can be more than one involved.. I do not know much about it, read about it when a kid about a number of horses in a military organization crossing a bridge all at the same pace, could or did hit the resonance frequency  and caused the bridge to crumble.  May have never happened but I picked it up somewhere and that term has stuck with me the rest of my life.  That term must have hit my resonance freqency!?

[kmmcrafts]

I think all saws have this issue, but that being said.. if you're on a 4 legged stand it's really hard to get all 4 legs planted onto the floor with exact even pressure so there is no rocking movement at all.. The smoothest saw I ever had was my DeWalt that had the 3 leg stand.. The Hegner is really smooth too with that 3 leg stand. I find with the 4 legged stands it's best to loosen the bolts to the stand and wiggle it around to get it settled into the permanent spot and then tighten the stand back up.. This helps a ton with those harmonic speeds to keep vibration and sound to a minimum. 

Last week I built a shelf inside the stand legs of my Hawk BM-26 and used some 1/8 thick aluminum angle cut to size and bolted into the already stamped holes in the stand. One of the Hawks I used to have that I bought used came with a shelf like I built. Those aluminum angle pieces I added stiffened up that stand a lot and it's running smoother than I've ever been able to get it. I'm surprised or maybe not, LOL that Hawk doesn't have some bracing on the lower part of the stands to stiffen it up, I mean the holes are there for it but the two new saws I've bought never came with any bracing. I always thought that first saw that had the shelf was a factory shelf option.. as i see similar on other saws on marketplace etc.. I don't see any shelf kit or anything from Hawk so maybe it was at one time.. either way, I'll be adding the shelf to the other Hawk soon to if nothing else it stiffens up the stand a lot. Every other saw stand I've seen / had has braces on the lower portion of the stand.. I never gave it much though I guess until I seen the difference in performance just by add that shelf brackets. 

[Oldmansbike]

9 hours ago, kmmcrafts said:

I think all saws have this issue, but that being said.. if you're on a 4 legged stand it's really hard to get all 4 legs planted onto the floor with exact even pressure so there is no rocking movement at all.. The smoothest saw I ever had was my DeWalt that had the 3 leg stand.. The Hegner is really smooth too with that 3 leg stand. I find with the 4 legged stands it's best to loosen the bolts to the stand and wiggle it around to get it settled into the permanent spot and then tighten the stand back up.. This helps a ton with those harmonic speeds to keep vibration and sound to a minimum. 

Last week I built a shelf inside the stand legs of my Hawk BM-26 and used some 1/8 thick aluminum angle cut to size and bolted into the already stamped holes in the stand. One of the Hawks I used to have that I bought used came with a shelf like I built. Those aluminum angle pieces I added stiffened up that stand a lot and it's running smoother than I've ever been able to get it. I'm surprised or maybe not, LOL that Hawk doesn't have some bracing on the lower part of the stands to stiffen it up, I mean the holes are there for it but the two new saws I've bought never came with any bracing. I always thought that first saw that had the shelf was a factory shelf option.. as i see similar on other saws on marketplace etc.. I don't see any shelf kit or anything from Hawk so maybe it was at one time.. either way, I'll be adding the shelf to the other Hawk soon to if nothing else it stiffens up the stand a lot. Every other saw stand I've seen / had has braces on the lower portion of the stand.. I never gave it much though I guess until I seen the difference in performance just by add that shelf brackets. 

My 1996 226vs came with the shelf kit. When I bought my 220vs a couple of years ago I went to the web site to order the shelf kit it wasn’t there. I still haven’t got around to making my own. 

[James E. Welch]

10 hours ago, kmmcrafts said:

I think all saws have this issue, but that being said.. if you're on a 4 legged stand it's really hard to get all 4 legs planted onto the floor with exact even pressure so there is no rocking movement at all.. The smoothest saw I ever had was my DeWalt that had the 3 leg stand.. The Hegner is really smooth too with that 3 leg stand. I find with the 4 legged stands it's best to loosen the bolts to the stand and wiggle it around to get it settled into the permanent spot and then tighten the stand back up.. This helps a ton with those harmonic speeds to keep vibration and sound to a minimum. 

Last week I built a shelf inside the stand legs of my Hawk BM-26 and used some 1/8 thick aluminum angle cut to size and bolted into the already stamped holes in the stand. One of the Hawks I used to have that I bought used came with a shelf like I built. Those aluminum angle pieces I added stiffened up that stand a lot and it's running smoother than I've ever been able to get it. I'm surprised or maybe not, LOL that Hawk doesn't have some bracing on the lower part of the stands to stiffen it up, I mean the holes are there for it but the two new saws I've bought never came with any bracing. I always thought that first saw that had the shelf was a factory shelf option.. as i see similar on other saws on marketplace etc.. I don't see any shelf kit or anything from Hawk so maybe it was at one time.. either way, I'll be adding the shelf to the other Hawk soon to if nothing else it stiffens up the stand a lot. Every other saw stand I've seen / had has braces on the lower portion of the stand.. I never gave it much though I guess until I seen the difference in performance just by add that shelf brackets. 

Mine is mounted to a countertop made out of 2x4's (think butcher block) lined up and glued together with 3/4 plywood on top and bottom. The counter is screwed to the wall and has 2x6 legs. It's not moving at all. LOL

It's not really a problem. I didn't mean for it to sound like it was an issue. My saw is butter smooth and I love it. I'm just pointing out a little quirky thing that happens at a certain speed. Thought it would be interesting to see if everyone had that experience. 

[kmmcrafts]

21 minutes ago, James E. Welch said:

Mine is mounted to a countertop made out of 2x4's (think butcher block) lined up and glued together with 3/4 plywood on top and bottom. The counter is screwed to the wall and has 2x6 legs. It's not moving at all. LOL

It's not really a problem. I didn't mean for it to sound like it was an issue. My saw is butter smooth and I love it. I'm just pointing out a little quirky thing that happens at a certain speed. Thought it would be interesting to see if everyone had that experience. 

Yeah I kind of figured that but figured I'd reply about the vibration from a stand that isn't set properly to the floor it is setting on. Over the years I have bought many used saws and even parts saws from cheap Harbor Freight style brands all the way up to the most recent Hegner that was given to me just to tinker with and or to rebuild / restore just to give it another life and make someone a good saw when I sell it. I can't tell you how many saws I went to "look / test" and a quality saw would dang near vibrate across the floor.. My first Hawk they was asking $350 for but when I went to look at it they had the saw bolted to a big piece of warped plywood and was in a shed with a wood and also very warped floor.. The saw vibrated horrible, I didn't know whether to buy it or not since I never had any experience with one of them but I had seen how they was supposed to be top of the line. I talked to seller about how smooth it should be and I thought there was something wrong with it. Seller not knowing either as it was his father's who had past a few years prior. He ended up saying if I want it I could take it for $100.. Brought it home and removed that warped plywood planform they had it bolted to and set it up on my concrete floor it ran quite a lot smoother.. That saw there really taught me how important having the stands legs planted to the floor good is just as important as having the blade square to the table or any other tune-up for a saw.  I know a lot of folks make wood stands but as much as wood breathes and moves I don't see how they can be vibration free at all speeds.. Get a real humid day and the wood expands a little.. I'm assuming the shear weight of the wood stand helps a lot with it all, I've never had a wood stand and I know a lot of folks use them that are happy with them so they must work. Same thing goes for stand that people put wheels on.. I don't see how they can keep them from vibrating. I've had a saw with wheels and tried my best to get the wheels planted to the shop floor good.. I never could get it to be nice and smooth running.   

[James E. Welch]

6 minutes ago, kmmcrafts said:

Yeah I kind of figured that but figured I'd reply about the vibration from a stand that isn't set properly to the floor it is setting on. Over the years I have bought many used saws and even parts saws from cheap Harbor Freight style brands all the way up to the most recent Hegner that was given to me just to tinker with and or to rebuild / restore just to give it another life and make someone a good saw when I sell it. I can't tell you how many saws I went to "look / test" and a quality saw would dang near vibrate across the floor.. My first Hawk they was asking $350 for but when I went to look at it they had the saw bolted to a big piece of warped plywood and was in a shed with a wood and also very warped floor.. The saw vibrated horrible, I didn't know whether to buy it or not since I never had any experience with one of them but I had seen how they was supposed to be top of the line. I talked to seller about how smooth it should be and I thought there was something wrong with it. Seller not knowing either as it was his father's who had past a few years prior. He ended up saying if I want it I could take it for $100.. Brought it home and removed that warped plywood planform they had it bolted to and set it up on my concrete floor it ran quite a lot smoother.. That saw there really taught me how important having the stands legs planted to the floor good is just as important as having the blade square to the table or any other tune-up for a saw.  I know a lot of folks make wood stands but as much as wood breathes and moves I don't see how they can be vibration free at all speeds.. Get a real humid day and the wood expands a little.. I'm assuming the shear weight of the wood stand helps a lot with it all, I've never had a wood stand and I know a lot of folks use them that are happy with them so they must work. Same thing goes for stand that people put wheels on.. I don't see how they can keep them from vibrating. I've had a saw with wheels and tried my best to get the wheels planted to the shop floor good.. I never could get it to be nice and smooth running.   

Good info. Thanks. I agree 100% with the wood moving. I think that would be a concern. I'm blessed to have an air-conditioned shop where the humidity and temperature stays at a fairly consistent level but others might not have that set up. I'm also in South Louisiana so cold isn't an issue. We're lucky if we get a couple of weeks in the 40's each year. 

[MarieC]

Wow, I scroll so slow .... at about the slowest one can possibly scroll, so I have never had an issue....I don't even know if there is a sweet spot or not a sweet spot on my Excalibur since I drive it at about 10 miles per hour (so to speak) no matter if I am in a hurry or not! 

[Norm Fengstad]

I have had dwalt now have a Seyco both verugood saws for me and both had a speed spot where vibration is the highest.