Regarding leaving blades tensioned when not in use.....

[kmmcrafts]

1 hour ago, OCtoolguy said:

A couple of things here J.T. I never said anything about going crazy on oiling. I was told at some point, maybe in the owner's manual, that it was wise to drop a couple of drops of light oil on the upper and lower arm bushings after every 10 hours of use. Seems fair to me. As to the second thing, I'd be interested, with your way of thinking, just how often you change the oil in your car. If you have never done that, as your saw, I'm truly amazed that it is still running. 

 

Ever notice how manufactures suggestions have changed a lot over the years? Now days they "claim" you only need to change the oil in your car every 7000 - 10000 miles.. I will agree with the fact that cars no longer need a oil change every 3000 like the old cars did.. With the computer controlled fuel systems burn fuel more efficient and it doesn't contaminate the oil as bad as it did years ago.. However any real mechanic out there that takes these motors apart for issues will tell you to never run them more than 5000 miles.. Timing chains are a common issue with most GM cars and much of it is due to a very small hole that oils the timing tensioner dirty oil and a lot of idle time reduces the oil flow.. the tensioners work off of oil pressure to push out onto the guides.. The GM Ecotec engines are terribly notorious for this.. very common with Chevy Equinox and like cars that run that Ecotec motor.. If you have one.. run good gas if it's the turbo one and keep the oil changed..  

Also, turbo and supercharged cars are more common these days.. especially turbos.. The manufacture says you can run regular 87 octane fuel.. however taking these apart that had run 87 all its life.. you find pitted pistons and all sorts of valve issues because of spark knock due to too low of octane.. at a minimum I would run the mid-grade.. They seem to tell people you can get by with this fuel because many won't buy a car that has to have the more expensive fuels.. they seem to get them through the warranty and then have lots of valvetrain and timing chain issues.. 

Anyway, my point is, I'm not sure there is such a thing as having maintained something too much.. It's fine to do the minimum if your the type that trades in a car every couple years.. but the poor folks buying used cars suffer the pain of poorly maintained cars..

As for these saws.. Hawk recommend a drop or two of oil on the wedge and the tension cam every 25 hours ( older saws also require a couple drops at the pivot points ( bearings ) in the upper and lower arms).. I don't see why anyone wouldn't do the minimum that the manufacture suggest.. It's not all that expensive to have a small can of oil and apply a couple drops every couple weeks.. I do more often than 25 hours and I also have multiple saws.. My can of oil I purchased 8 years ago is still dang near full and I've oiled more than just saws with it.. I can understand if the oil was half the cost of a new saw or whatever but it's not the case and there is no reason not to maintain something at least to the level of the minimum that's suggested.. 

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

1 hour ago, OCtoolguy said:

A couple of things here J.T. I never said anything about going crazy on oiling. I was told at some point, maybe in the owner's manual, that it was wise to drop a couple of drops of light oil on the upper and lower arm bushings after every 10 hours of use. Seems fair to me. As to the second thing, I'd be interested, with your way of thinking, just how often you change the oil in your car. If you have never done that, as your saw, I'm truly amazed that it is still running. 

 

They are called sealed bearings my friend. Every 10 hours could be like every other day you are oiling. I change my oil every 7,000 miles which comes out to twice a year. I am retired. My saw is RBI's If Hegner says oil then oil. Just seems excessive.  I understand the pivot points Kevin eludes to and I watch them what can I tell you my pivot wedge does not move. the tension handle will wear with or without oil. I did spray dry lube on it when I replaced it 5 years ago. Oil changes in cars is subjective. i do not work on cars any more but between 6 and 7,000 it gets oil changed. Why did they do away with all the grease fittings on cars today. They build them differently today. Today they tell you it is a bad idea to let cars sit and idle especially warming them up like we use to. It wears things down faster than getting and driving. Oil is dispersed faster that way. Hey do what you want but you can not tell me oiling every 10 hours is normal. Sorry.

Edited November 29, 2023 by JTTHECLOCKMAN

[kmmcrafts]

50 minutes ago, JTTHECLOCKMAN said:

They are called sealed bearings my friend. Every 10 hours could be like every other day you are oiling. I change my oil every 7,000 miles which comes out to twice a year. I am retired. My saw is RBI's If Hegner says oil then oil. Just seems excessive.  I understand the pivot points Kevin eludes to and I watch them what can I tell you my pivot wedge does not move. the tension handle will wear with or without oil. I did spray dry lube on it when I replaced it 5 years ago. Oil changes in cars is subjective. i do not work on cars any more but between 6 and 7,000 it gets oil changed. Why did they do away with all the grease fittings on cars today. They build them differently today. Today they tell you it is a bad idea to let cars sit and idle especially warming them up like we use to. It wears things down faster than getting and driving. Oil is dispersed faster that way. Hey do what you want but you can not tell me oiling every 10 hours is normal. Sorry.

There is only two sealed bearings in a Hawk saw.. Those would be in the bar that connects the motor to the lower arm.. The bearings in the upper and lower arms are not sealed bearings...

Cars don't use grease fittings anymore because of a couple reasons.. 1 being the majority of cars was lacking in getting greased in the first place and 2. it was a advertising ploy to say it never needs greased again.. and they can actually sell you more parts. Failure to grease the grease fittings on cars would leave a part ungreased and also allowed water to get trapped into the boots and prematurely wear the parts out.. a sealed part is just that.. they pack it full of grease and seal it.. it's just a throw away part that typically last long enough to get the car out of warranty.. Most quality repair shops that are not a dealer service center will replace the parts with quality greasable parts.. provided they always come in to be serviced at that shop so they get greased.. otherwise they may just put on another sealed part.. Moog brand suspension parts are lifetime warranted and come with grease fittings.. most others are just sealed parts.. Moog stands behind the warranty too.. If it wears out / break's.. they'll replace it free of charge... The sealed ones are also " lifetime " however the fine print shows a " expected lifetime " LOL .. I've seen Moog warranty stuff free when it clearly was never even greased, LOL but that could be whoever you get for that warranty claim too.. each person may or maynot warranty it IF it was never greased.. You get what you pay for.. Moog isn't the cheapest replacement parts.. but again.. lifetime warrantied vrs. limited lifetime.  

[Sycamore67]

This thread has gone a lot of places....

Someone said "They are called sealed bearings my friend."

Maybe on your saw but on my Hegner that is totally wrong.  They have upper and lower arm bushings not sealed bearings.  The Hegners have been built like this for decades and works well. I keep reading about people having to change there bears on other saws but not an issue on the Hegner.

Yes, Hegner suggests a little bit of oil every 10 hours.

And with this, I am going to ignore any additional advice on this thread.

[OCtoolguy]

3 hours ago, JTTHECLOCKMAN said:

They are called sealed bearings my friend. Every 10 hours could be like every other day you are oiling. I change my oil every 7,000 miles which comes out to twice a year. I am retired. My saw is RBI's If Hegner says oil then oil. Just seems excessive.  I understand the pivot points Kevin eludes to and I watch them what can I tell you my pivot wedge does not move. the tension handle will wear with or without oil. I did spray dry lube on it when I replaced it 5 years ago. Oil changes in cars is subjective. i do not work on cars any more but between 6 and 7,000 it gets oil changed. Why did they do away with all the grease fittings on cars today. They build them differently today. Today they tell you it is a bad idea to let cars sit and idle especially warming them up like we use to. It wears things down faster than getting and driving. Oil is dispersed faster that way. Hey do what you want but you can not tell me oiling every 10 hours is normal. Sorry.

I guess because they use bushings rather than bearings. And, oil is cheap. So why not?

 

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

Wow this thread really took off into a whole different direction from tensioning blades. Now we are talking about cars. I hope that you all pay attention to other tools as you do the scrollsaw. Blades on tablesaws and bandsaws need cleaning every so often. Those tools also need love and care too as well as any tool that has motors and moving parts. I am done. Oil do not oil I could care less. No more advice from me. 

I had to go back to reread my comments of what turned the spear on me and I do not see it other than I mentioned Ray oiling every 10 hours but I did mentioned that is his thing so be fine. I did not say do not do maintenance on anywhere in that post. I mentioned I never oiled my RBI saw as long as I had them so that is me. If your manuel says oil and whatever thing it tells you to do then follow those recomendations. . I stand behind my thought that if a saw needs oiling every 10 hours than it is not worth the money they ask for them. Why not put an oiler on it then too? This question was about tension left on the blade when done scrolling. Again book recommends take it off and yet other say they left on. Does it have an ill effect on the saw who really knows. 

As far as cars goes I am too old to work on cars any more. I have a great mechanic that can take any engine apart and rebuild it. I trust him. 

Edited November 30, 2023 by JTTHECLOCKMAN

[kmmcrafts]

Well, I know of a couple different people ( one is here on the village I won't mention the names ) that never once oiled their Hegner and it got so badly worn that it wouldn't saw correctly.. They tried replacing the bushing and it was out of stock and wouldn't be available for some time as everything was backed up due to Covid.. Hegner did have a complete new upper arm but seems like they also needed a special bolt? Said person just bought a brand new saw and would later repair the old saw as a backup.. That all being said.. I would oil the Hegners at least once in a while, LOL...

I've gotta say that it's pretty impressive that JT's saws are still running strong after nearly 30 years and many of these years was used in a production type setting.. and he never once oiled it.. 

I know of two different people on the FB groups that had hawks and I have no idea if they maintained them or not.. they was 35-40 year old saws used in production type setting their whole life and the upper arm had worn clean through where that wedge rides on it.. There is probably many more cases of that because Hawk redesigned the arms to accept a insert.. this way you will never wear out a saw.. you might wear out the wedge and the insert but for about $30 you can just replace those parts and go back at it for another 30 years or?  

Not to discriminate on any brand of saw but, for the money you pay for these new Pegas saws..or any saw in that near $1000 price range.. How many of them will not really need any major repairs in 30 years of production type use.. let alone never oiled like the manufacture suggest.. Maybe the Hawk prices have gone up but the last I knew a 20" new Hawk was $1200.. not too far from these other line of saws..

JT, Bushton should send you a new saw.. that's one heck of an advertisement right there.. 

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

3 hours ago, kmmcrafts said:

Well, I know of a couple different people ( one is here on the village I won't mention the names ) that never once oiled their Hegner and it got so badly worn that it wouldn't saw correctly.. They tried replacing the bushing and it was out of stock and wouldn't be available for some time as everything was backed up due to Covid.. Hegner did have a complete new upper arm but seems like they also needed a special bolt? Said person just bought a brand new saw and would later repair the old saw as a backup.. That all being said.. I would oil the Hegners at least once in a while, LOL...

I've gotta say that it's pretty impressive that JT's saws are still running strong after nearly 30 years and many of these years was used in a production type setting.. and he never once oiled it.. 

I know of two different people on the FB groups that had hawks and I have no idea if they maintained them or not.. they was 35-40 year old saws used in production type setting their whole life and the upper arm had worn clean through where that wedge rides on it.. There is probably many more cases of that because Hawk redesigned the arms to accept a insert.. this way you will never wear out a saw.. you might wear out the wedge and the insert but for about $30 you can just replace those parts and go back at it for another 30 years or?  

Not to discriminate on any brand of saw but, for the money you pay for these new Pegas saws..or any saw in that near $1000 price range.. How many of them will not really need any major repairs in 30 years of production type use.. let alone never oiled like the manufacture suggest.. Maybe the Hawk prices have gone up but the last I knew a 20" new Hawk was $1200.. not too far from these other line of saws..

JT, Bushton should send you a new saw.. that's one heck of an advertisement right there.. 

Kevin all I can say and have said this many times here I do not see that wedge move one iota when scrolling. I do not know why , only that I never change the back tension since I got it. I use to at one time long ago change when I used jewlers blades but even stopped that I rarely change speeds on both those saws. I know the wedge is free because it does rattle when I take tension off. but believe me it is as sharp as the day I bought it. I did have to put a felt piece on the arm because that lever would work its way over to the arm and clatter. That was annoying but a quick fix and has been that way for a long time. There is no friction at the pivot points in both upper and lower arms on both saws. As I said I did have to change the front tension lever and recently found the thread that got me in alot of trouble here and led to one reason I left here. https://www.scrollsawvillage.com/forums/topic/36965-rbi/#comment-408618. I have been scrolling for over 30 years now and my path has been documented here a few times of what I did along that path. I have scrolled on these 2 RBI saws for the best part of all that time. I mentioned I had a hegner before I got the RBI which was the first year they came out with those block shaped blade holders. You would know years more than I. I do not remember. the woodworking show I bought the saw at the person do the demo kept talking about the upgrade. Whatever motor they finally went with in those has served me well. These saws  run quiet and true as the day I bought them. I am still using them even in my pen turning adventures so. But I have told everyone how many stores I sold in and how many shows I did and shown the work I do. I only wish and someday maybe I will find a way to transform all the still photos of all the work I use to make when I first started and the large projects I worked on to digital so that they can be used in forums.  These saws saw many times 6 to 7 or 8 hours of sawing a day when I was full blown especially weekends. Keeping stock was a job. Not complaining just noting. After I got the RBI saws and the 220 is about 1 to 2 years older because I had to get a 226 because of the mirrors and other bigger projects I was cutting. My Hegner was then dedicated to doing strictly angle cutting for collapsible baskets and trivets which I made over 100 of. I really did not like their blade system and not sure what they are now. but that wedge design was a pain in the butt. As you know not have a blade tension system up front I had to tighten blade by turning and loosening the back screw. Thus the move to the RBI I scrolled on my friends RBI but he still had the barrel clamps and they were fine but the new system was 10 times better. 

I am guessing RBI has gotten their act together after the change over. In that link I was having a huge hard time getting parts and it was costing me precious time. getting frustrated and I guess I pushed calling them out too hard for the money you spend on their saws that Travis took exception and slapped me. So I do not have any intention of getting into verbal wars with whoever wants to disagree with any advice I try to give or any things I post here any more. What has worked for me may not for everyone and everyone has to do what is best for them and their tools. Weather that is oiling or using dry lube on parts that pivot and following instructions. It is always wise to follow instructions and get to know your tools and what is proper. I am not telling anyone to do anything different. Lucky maybe but my saws owe me nothing for as long as I used them and certainly can say I used them in an industrial type setting. I maintain all my tools. if i have to down the road replace a part I have knowledge to do it and will. But I will from now on be careful about what I suggest or any info I put out there. I tried to preface things all the time saying this is what I do or did. Happy Scrolling to all.   

Edited November 30, 2023 by JTTHECLOCKMAN

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

2 hours ago, JTTHECLOCKMAN said:

Kevin all I can say and have said this many times here I do not see that wedge move one iota when scrolling. I do not know why , only that I never change the back tension since I got it. I use to at one time long ago change when I used jewlers blades but even stopped that I rarely change speeds on both those saws. I know the wedge is free because it does rattle when I take tension off. but believe me it is as sharp as the day I bought it. I did have to put a felt piece on the arm because that lever would work its way over to the arm and clatter. That was annoying but a quick fix and has been that way for a long time. There is no friction at the pivot points in both upper and lower arms on both saws. As I said I did have to change the front tension lever and recently found the thread that got me in alot of trouble here and led to one reason I left here. https://www.scrollsawvillage.com/forums/topic/36965-rbi/#comment-408618. I have been scrolling for over 30 years now and my path has been documented here a few times of what I did along that path. I have scrolled on these 2 RBI saws for the best part of all that time. I mentioned I had a hegner before I got the RBI which was the first year they came out with those block shaped blade holders. You would know years more than I. I do not remember. the woodworking show I bought the saw at the person do the demo kept talking about the upgrade. Whatever motor they finally went with in those has served me well. These saws  run quiet and true as the day I bought them. I am still using them even in my pen turning adventures so. But I have told everyone how many stores I sold in and how many shows I did and shown the work I do. I only wish and someday maybe I will find a way to transform all the still photos of all the work I use to make when I first started and the large projects I worked on to digital so that they can be used in forums.  These saws saw many times 6 to 7 or 8 hours of sawing a day when I was full blown especially weekends. Keeping stock was a job. Not complaining just noting. After I got the RBI saws and the 220 is about 1 to 2 years older because I had to get a 226 because of the mirrors and other bigger projects I was cutting. My Hegner was then dedicated to doing strictly angle cutting for collapsible baskets and trivets which I made over 100 of. I really did not like their blade system and not sure what they are now. but that wedge design was a pain in the butt. As you know not have a blade tension system up front I had to tighten blade by turning and loosening the back screw. Thus the move to the RBI I scrolled on my friends RBI but he still had the barrel clamps and they were fine but the new system was 10 times better. 

I am guessing RBI has gotten their act together after the change over. In that link I was having a huge hard time getting parts and it was costing me precious time. getting frustrated and I guess I pushed calling them out too hard for the money you spend on their saws that Travis took exception and slapped me. So I do not have any intention of getting into verbal wars with whoever wants to disagree with any advice I try to give or any things I post here any more. What has worked for me may not for everyone and everyone has to do what is best for them and their tools. Weather that is oiling or using dry lube on parts that pivot and following instructions. It is always wise to follow instructions and get to know your tools and what is proper. I am not telling anyone to do anything different. Lucky maybe but my saws owe me nothing for as long as I used them and certainly can say I used them in an industrial type setting. I maintain all my tools. if i have to down the road replace a part I have knowledge to do it and will. But I will from now on be careful about what I suggest or any info I put out there. I tried to preface things all the time saying this is what I do or did. Happy Scrolling to all.   

By the way I sold my Hegner 2 years ago for $450. I was asking $500 but guy got me for $50. That saw was still a great saw and he would get many years out of it. Even the bellows were still flexible and in good shape. I told him  that was a weak point and how to replace. Sold the Dewalt 788 for $250 same year. So left with the 2 RBIs.  

I looked up my saws and found dates. Bought my Hegner in 1993, Bought the Hawk 220vs in Jan.  1998 and 226 in 1999. before all these saws I scrolled on a Dremel 16" 2 speed saw. That was fun. 

Now I may jinx the saws but think I will put a few drops of oil on the pivot points mentioned. Wish me luck. 

Edited November 30, 2023 by JTTHECLOCKMAN

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

OK update. I oiled the pivot points today on RBIs and again checked that wedge still pristine. Used a little dry lube on the tension lever. Now I will not be oiling this every 20 hours as they recommend in the instruction book. That is ridiculous. ( MY THOUGHTS) One thing and again this is my thoughts but it is true with lathes as well as other woodworking tools, when you apply oil to moving parts such as those pivot points you now have created a spot where dust and debris can and will collect more readily So when I oiled I wiped around that section to keep oil off the arms. This could start a friction problem and cause more harm than good. I will be aware of this. I know Kevin put a timer on his saws and that can help tell how much use it has. I wish I knew how much running time is on these but I can say without blinking it is a long time and that is no bull. These saws have been used hard. To this day I highly recommend them to anyone buying a saw. yes you can find good deals as used saws but you just never know how well they were used. I believe Hegner is overpriced for what they sell. Do not get me wrong, they too are a great saw.  I have no idea about the other type saws such as Pegasus. I do not like that double link system. I had the Dewalt and that saw basically sat in the corner. I rarely used it. Blades can be installed at any height and tension is not always the same . I am and always will be a bottom feeder so no interest in top feeding features. Again that is me. I learned that way and am fine with it. The blade changing system on the RBI and again I do not know much about the newer models but the ones I have are great. You can not make a mistake of how far or how high to insert blades. they go in the same each and every time. That is why I rarely break blades. My saw is tensioned to same blade all the time. No need to keep changing size of blades.  just the way I did things all these years. I do not start and stop many times when cutting. I start saw in each fret hole and stop when done. If I have to shave a piece I keep saw moving. I have learned to turn while saw is running.  Maybe that is a reason that the saw has not been abused. Starting and stopping a motor is torque applied to many things. After each session of cutting I always vac the entire saw down to collect dust. I do not use a dust collector on my saws. I do wear a mask but I wear a mask most times I am in the shop anyway. I grew up in the construction field so those masks are like a part of your uniform. And I use safety glasses. i have an air cleaner system that is basically right next to those saws because my shop is small. I keep that clean and vaced too. To sum up why has my saw been so free of problems I do not know. Maybe luck, maybe I got the 2 best saw ever made by RBI. I do not know. But they have served me well and as I said they owe me nothing. Again this is my way of doing things. Follow your heart and follow instructions and keep those saws motoring. Have fun and enjoy the ride. Good luck and happy scrolling. 

I know this topic went off course somewhere down the road but to bring it full circle I do not leave tension on my blades when done sawing. 

Edited November 30, 2023 by JTTHECLOCKMAN

[kmmcrafts]

I probably should clarify that the new Hawk manual states to use a dry spray lube on the wedge.. a drop of oil for the hole above the tension cam lever at the front of the saw.. no need to oil the bearings in the arm pivot points.. They are not sealed bearing but they are "shielded" bearings and the way they set in the arm I'm doubtful oil would work its way down into them anyway. I tried to look on their site for the new BM series manual but I guess they haven't uploaded that one..

The older saws manual mentions to use oil on the wedge and the arm pivot points and front tension cam oil hole. Some of those early saws had a ball bearing in a plastic type cage and I would definitely recommend oil for those.. however,  You should read your manual and make your own decisions as to how you want to best maintain the saw..

I do not use oil on the wedge of any of my saws, I have in the past on my older saws as that was what was recommended.. New technology on lubricant's and experiences of worn parts have made Bushton change the new saws to the dry lube.. Probably for the very reason JT mentions it as a dust and dirt magnet.. for that very reason I have switch to dry lube on all my saws.. including the front tension cam which they state to use a drop of oil.. 

My new saw has just shy of 500 run time hours on it.. My old 226 Ultra has 300 run time hours and the old Hawk with the round clamps I sold but it also had around 300 hours at time of sale.. The Hegner has 3 hours on it, LOL.. That old saw had a slightly worn wedge.. no idea on if it was oiled or not or how many hours the saw had on it when I got it.. the tension cam was worn so bad they had used a spring to wrap around the tension lever to keep it tensioned.. so I upgraded that to the newer system that Hawk offers.. so the saw was used quite a lot I believe and I don't think it was maintained to well but I don't really know.. Anyway I just put the wedge on a flat surface and sanded it to a nice sharp point again.. no need to replace it...  None of my saws really have any signs of wear.. Other than the Excalibur in which that saw has 505 hours on it right now.. it has had a complete rebuild at the 200 hour mark.. its showing signs of looseness again but not knocking or anything like that yet... again so 

The funny thing with the hour meter on the saw and hooked to the foot switch is.. You can spend 50 hours a week in the shop but be lucky to put 15 - 20 hours on the saw.. I would say if a person oiled the saw once a month it's probably good enough.. but that is just a uneducated guess based on how much I use the saw and how much I speculate a weekend hobbyist would run their saw.. Just to give some unscientific data to those that think they need to oil it every day / week etc.. 

This topic has changed the subject several times now,    

This is the dry lube I've been using.. I forgot to add the link to what I use.. https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/blaster-premium-silicone-garage-door-lubricant-1300631?store=743&cid=Shopping-Google-Local_Feed&utm_medium=Google&utm_source=Shopping&utm_campaign=&utm_content=Local_Feed&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQiAgqGrBhDtARIsAM5s0_lalN2Dl1EtdTpuOj0iIbAaK7VTYzKMps-WhGM9bejtBMmKRmbOuh8aAuVnEALw_wcB

Edited November 30, 2023 by kmmcrafts

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

I figured those bushings/bearings were enclosed or something because no oil ran in just down the sides. Did not feel any different but that is what the manual said and no oil on that lever. That is too close to dust for oil in my opinion. The oil on the wedge in the back to me was a waste of time but manual said do it so I must obey manual. 

I have a question for you Kevin. Being you saw on different system saws which do you prefer?  On the Excalibur is the blade set in clamps that are always dialed into the same spot or are they like the Dewalt where you can slide the blade up high or low as much as you want. The RBI has a set max with the bar behind the blade in the block type holders. Not sure if they still use those in the new version. But I like that so much because sometimes you get blades that are just a little longer and what I do is snip some off to keep the same tension on all blades. I just did not like that short action of the arms when sawing as with the Dewalt. So use to the Hegner and then after that the RBI. I got that Dewalt dirt cheap so had to buy it brand new when Home Depot was clearing them out. With stand $80  Type#1 It litterly crawled in the truck before I could pay for it. I would have bought every one they had but no more available within NJ. I had guy check for me. Also with the RBI blade holders, the blade is always straight up and down when inserted. Dewalt it could lean forward or back. Hegner you had to have that key to tighten blade in clamp. 

Edited November 30, 2023 by JTTHECLOCKMAN

[rafairchild2]

My trick for always having the same tension on my Excal 21" w. Pegas Chuck

First I flip the lever back so I can see the screw in the chuck. Then I thread through the hole. I place the blade in the top chuck, so the top of the blade is at the top of the chuck screw. (image 1) Once tightened I flip the lever back down to the normal untensioned position.  I then make sure the bottom blade is set into the bottom chuck and then tighten the bottom knob.  Next, I loosen the top chuck and pull up on the blade gently removing slack, and then retighten top. (image 2) Flip the lever to tension on.  I have the same tension for every type of blade, and have never broken a blade.

Edited November 30, 2023 by rafairchild2

[kmmcrafts]

2 hours ago, JTTHECLOCKMAN said:

 

I have a question for you Kevin. Being you saw on different system saws which do you prefer?  

The new Hawk is hands down my favorite saw and a close second is the Hawk 226VS Ultra from 1998 (  same as your saws with the kind of square blade holders ) The new Hawk has very similar style blade holders too but they are slightly bigger and have a rounded bottom corners.. 

As for getting the same blade tension every single time.. There is no saw on the market other than Hawk that will do that.. The fine folks at Bushton told me they call it a Hawk "Precision" scroll saw for a reason, LOL.. There is no other saw so precise made currently.. How important is that? I don't know.. I mean the Excalibur and DeWalt saws with those short arms are not nearly as picky about tension and are easier on saw blades too because those short arms give the blade a rocking back and forth motion which helps clear sawdust and give the blade a millisecond or so to cool off.. Blade last a bit longer in those shorter arms on these type of saws.. That rocking motion makes for a bit more aggressive cutting... great for doing larger profile cuts like the big batch of clocks I just did.. the EX cuts though that profile a bit faster.. Even with the blade aggression set as perfect as you can get it, it is still more aggressive than a Hawk.. I can use either saw for fine detail work but I find that the Hawk is just way more enjoyable to do those tough detail cuts.. while the Hawk maybe a tad slower at cutting.. the quick no hassle blade changes with no guesswork on tension etc.. makes up more than enough time and actually get projects completed faster and more relaxed in those tight corners etc.. than with the EX type saws.. as you seen in my video the other day cutting out those clocks.. I was using the EX and I was stopping the saw and restarting on some tighter spots.. partly because the camera with in the way of my view but the other part was it's a bit aggressive in those tight spots.. I don't have to think twice about those tight spots with the Hawk.. 

If you go back and watch that video you'll notice that on changing to the next hole when tensioning the blade I use one finger to push downward on the upper blade chuck and I hold the blade with the other hand pulling up on it to take out the slack in all those bearings, LOL.. I also tighten the tension lever slightly to also pull down on the upper arm and then loosen the thumb screw and re-tighten it.. None of that garbage has to happen with the Hawk, LOL.. and doing fretwork the Hawk is hands down faster to get the job done for these reason.. and again, more relaxing to use. Cutting those thick 3/4" puzzles the EX is faster because it is more aggressive and there isn't too many inside cuts to puzzles.. so I'd rather use the EX if I need to get a order out.. again otherwise the Hawk is more relaxing and enjoyable to use.. IF I was to ever do much angle cutting the EX would be my choice of saw because the table stays flat.. 

IF I could only have one saw the new Hawk would be what I'd have.. but the best is owning both the new Hawk and the EX.. as there are times I want that faster more aggressive cut.. but most times I'd rather use the Hawk..   

[OCtoolguy]

Dang! Now you two have got me wanting another Hawk. I had the 226 VS Ultra but it was too big for my shop. So I'll have to start a search for a good used 220 VS and see how it works. I do see them all the time for under $300 so I might have to sell of an Ex to make room and find the money. Wouldn't that be neat? I'll be like Kevin and have one of each. 

[kmmcrafts]

1 hour ago, OCtoolguy said:

Dang! Now you two have got me wanting another Hawk. I had the 226 VS Ultra but it was too big for my shop. So I'll have to start a search for a good used 220 VS and see how it works. I do see them all the time for under $300 so I might have to sell of an Ex to make room and find the money. Wouldn't that be neat? I'll be like Kevin and have one of each. 

Nah, you don't like how much room they take up, and the tall stand.. Keep the Ex and enjoy making projects.. You're not production cutting so you likely won't wear it out.. if you do you have a back-up and I don't see you wearing both out.. LOL

[OCtoolguy]

6 minutes ago, kmmcrafts said:

Nah, you don't like how much room they take up, and the tall stand.. Keep the Ex and enjoy making projects.. You're not production cutting so you likely won't wear it out.. if you do you have a back-up and I don't see you wearing both.  LOL

But I did like how my Hawk ran and cut. I hated to part with it. The 220 will be 6 inches shorter footprint and would fit much better. And heck, I enjoy the search. 

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

Thanks Kevin. I had the same feelings with the Dewalt because it worked on the same system. yes the Hawks as so easy to thread blades and retighten that one hand puts blade in and other tightens thumbscrew. It is a no brainer when you blade is set. That is why I kept those 2 saws. yes they take up some room but my area is dedicated to the saws and have no problem. They are sitting on a basement concrete floor so there is no bounce or creeping. Rock solid. 

When I had the Dewalt that system had more rocking of the blade than the RBI so I did the fix that was going around at that time to get most of it out. there was very little back to front movement. My fix was a piece of wood to take it out of the back end.