Trying to understand the cause of vibration?

[Hawk]

Ok, I had my 16" King running quite good, vibration was almost none existent, passed the Nickle test with flying colors. Moved it to another bench, as solid as the previous, and now I can't get it to pass the nickle test even in the lower speeds. So I sat there trying everything I could think of and still theres enough vibration to tick off a person (lol).

So I'm trying to understand what adjustments I can make, how they affect the saw,  like rotating the motor, what exactly does that adjust? I honestly don't remember. Would upgrading the chuck heads help? maybe bolting it to the bench? 

The vibration isn't real bad, the nickle will stay on it's edge but has a small amount of movement, not enough to knock it over but movement none the less.

Having read thru as many of the posts dealing with vibration I'm at wits end on how to eliminate vibration, my Delta P-20 runs as calm as a still lake at all speeds am I'm expecting the King to do the same, am I barking up a dead tree on that?

Anyhow, a litle venting here, thanks for listening (lol) but I'll keep tinkering with it trying to get vibration free. 

Edited March 4 by Hawk

[Wichman]

What kind of floor is the bench sitting on?

Is the bench firmly standing on the floor. i.e. no rocking of any kind?

When I first set up my Hegner I had to move the stand around to find a non-bouncy floor, once I did that the vibration was minimal.

Just a thought. Good Luck.

 

[Hawk]

@Wichman, I have it on a concrete floor, not the most level, but I shim the legs to make it rock steady on the floor.  Thanks though, weird part is, it's still in the same spot in the shop, just a different bench, this one is bigger and heavier, still though something changed, the mystery thickens....  

[Sycamore67]

I do not understand the issue.  The nickel still stay upright but a little more vibration.  Is it cutting ok?  

[Hawk]

21 minutes ago, Sycamore67 said:

I do not understand the issue.  The nickel still stay upright but a little more vibration.  Is it cutting ok?  

The nickle will stay upright but still moves a bit. Cutting is ok, but in my brain I'm trying to get to zero vibration like my P-20. Had it there once, just one of those little things that get under my skin that I want to try to fix. There may be no "fix" to it, but I still like to try.

[JTTHECLOCKMAN]

Did the legs of the saw change any. Maybe try spreading if they can. Or maybe the rubber grommets need to be moved .Is the bench top flat? 

[Hawk]

1 hour ago, JTTHECLOCKMAN said:

Did the legs of the saw change any. Maybe try spreading if they can. Or maybe the rubber grommets need to be moved .Is the bench top flat? 

The things you mentioned have been on my mind too, I'll be checking those out Wednesday.  Never thought about the rubber grommets, so I'll definitely check those. 

[TAIrving]

Mine (Pegas) sits on a bench also, concrete floor, solid bench.  I had to adjust the levelers on the feet to stop the vibration.  

[kmmcrafts]

I think you'll find your problem is like Thurman said above.. you probably need to adjust the rubber feet. The feet might have been planted to the table very well on the surface of the old table / benchtop.. maybe the new or old bench has a slight low spot and one of the rubber feet is not firm to the bench now.  I have a brand new shop and new concrete floor.. my saw will tell me if it has been moved even just the slightest amount because it'll pick up some extra vibration. I place my saws where they'll be permanently parked.. then adjust the feet to that particular spot.. If I move the saw even the slightest amount.. I have to readjust the feet again.  

[Hawk]

Interesting development.  My schedule didn't allow me any shop time for 3 days and when I went down today to try to solve the vibration it was all but gone, all the issues I was having. 

I can only speculate that @kmmcrafts and @TAIrving are on to something that after moving the saw it needed time to "settle " into its new position. 

Well, I'm just glad it's back to normal. 

Thanks everyone for the help.

Chris

[rash_powder]

After solving the bulk of my vibration troubles I found bench weight and flex were the main problems.  I've noticed too that if the blade isn't tightened the way the saw likes there will be vibrations too.  

[Dak0ta52]

I built a stand for my first saw (a WEN) and it vibrated like crazy, The top of the stand was made with 3/4 ply. I removed the saw, replaced the 3/4 ply with a solid piece of 2X material and the little WEN would pass the nickle test. My be the difference in the top of your bench compared to where you had it previously. You may be able to strengthen it by glue and screw from the bottom side with 2X material.

[OCtoolguy]

I'm curious, nobody has mentioned whether or not you bolted the saw to the bench. All of my saws are bolted to their respective stands and all the stands are sitting on foam rubber "floor mats". I don't have any vibration from any of them with the exception of a couple of speed settings. I very seldom if ever run them at top speed. I find the "sweet spot" and pretty much run them at that setting. I know for fact that the Hegners are very finicky about how they are bolted to their stands. They have 3 bolts and those bolts MUST be tightened in the correct order or the saw will vibrate.

 

[Joe W.]

My scroll saw is bolted to a three legged wooden stand with a thick piece of carpet between the base of the saw and the 2 inch thick wood platform.
No complaints.
When I first got into this I came across a website article that promoted mounting the SS in a box filled with sand to dampen/diminish vibration.

[barb.j.enders]

After reading this thread, I realized how much my saw "walked" across the floor.  Doesn't help that it is a sloped floor.  I bought these blocks.  Wow!!!  They are working great.  https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B08251YJM4?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details

[BadBob]

15 hours ago, Joe W. said:

When I first got into this I came across a website article that promoted mounting the SS in a box filled with sand to dampen/diminish vibration.

My Pegas saw came with a shelf made from 1-inch-thick oak. I was thinking about building the sandbox, so I put 60 lbs of aquarium gravel on the shelf as an experiment. As far as I could tell, it made little or no difference.

I usually run my saws at their particular sweet spot unless a different speed is required.

I don't see how you could have a scroll saw with zero vibration.

[Hawk]

On 3/15/2024 at 9:06 AM, BadBob said:

I don't see how you could have a scroll saw with zero vibration.

My Delta P-20 comes pretty darn close, but it's quite a heavy beast. The nickle doesn't even budge when it's running. Like you, I've found the sweet spot and pretty much leave it there. 

[Hawk]

@barb.j.enders, thanks for the idea, I will definitely look into getting some of these! 

[Sycamore67]

I think eliminating vibrations is one of those things with diminishing returns. You get to the point where vibrations are quite low and anything more you try results in very small improvements.  The question is when do you stop and start making sawdust.  If it passes the nickel test, I would leave it alone.  Does the small vibration cause any cutting problems?

[Hawk]

@Sycamore67, I totally agree with that statement.