jimmyG Posted June 9 Report Share Posted June 9 Spent more time than I will admit finally making a picture frame jig sled. Many attempts trying to get the angles right with a few do overs dealing with glue that was set and pulling up some ply vaneer. I still had to use painters tape to shim one side to get a decent, hopefully acceptable miter. The YouTube videos make it look easy. Didn't know if the inside or outside of the miter was the most important! crupiea and OCtoolguy 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCtoolguy Posted June 9 Report Share Posted June 9 @FrankEV made a sled a while back. Maybe he will chime in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTTHECLOCKMAN Posted June 9 Report Share Posted June 9 If you are cutting the miters on a tablesaw, there are many videos on the net that show tablesaw sleds that are real easy to make. The key is to make the sled fit to your saw. Use both miter slots to support the surface board and then build off that using the blade as your reference point. never use a fence to reference off unless the fence was built off the blade. The most important factor is to use the same length sides that are opposite if doing a 4 sided frame. Here is a photo of one of mine that I use for many things but can easily adapt to make picture frames with. I build these for all angles that I need instead of using a varying fence because I feel once set up there is no fussing when angle is changed. OCtoolguy, Dave Monk and NC Scroller 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmyG Posted June 9 Author Report Share Posted June 9 9 minutes ago, JTTHECLOCKMAN said: If you are cutting the miters on a tablesaw, there are many videos on the net that show tablesaw sleds that are real easy to make. The key is to make the sled fit to your saw. Use both miter slots to support the surface board and then build off that using the blade as your reference point. never use a fence to reference off unless the fence was built off the blade. The most important factor is to use the same length sides that are opposite if doing a 4 sided frame. Here is a photo of one of mine that I use for many things but can easily adapt to make picture frames with. I build these for all angles that I need instead of using a varying fence because I feel once set up there is no fussing when angle is changed. My sorry ass attempt to use only for picture frames if I ever learn how to make them. Probably used a cheap square to reference the blade. The painter's tape saved me from beating the glued rails from the sled for yet another do over. I have a lot to learn. OCtoolguy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTTHECLOCKMAN Posted June 10 Report Share Posted June 10 5 hours ago, jimmyG said: My sorry ass attempt to use only for picture frames if I ever learn how to make them. Probably used a cheap square to reference the blade. The painter's tape saved me from beating the glued rails from the sled for yet another do over. I have a lot to learn. With that type sled I suggest you put a stiffener type fence at the front of that sled. It will keep it from cracking down the cut line. the best squares to use is a machinist's square or an architects square. They are the most accurate. You always square off the blade on the flat of the blade and not on the teeth. One factor that comes into play many times when making frames and cutting on a tablesaw is the quality of the saw and the blade. if there is runout in the arbor of the saw then this can show up in the cuts. same goes for blades. If warped it transfers to the cuts. Good luck NC Scroller and OCtoolguy 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmyG Posted June 10 Author Report Share Posted June 10 11 hours ago, JTTHECLOCKMAN said: With that type sled I suggest you put a stiffener type fence at the front of that sled. It will keep it from cracking down the cut line. the best squares to use is a machinist's square or an architects square. They are the most accurate. You always square off the blade on the flat of the blade and not on the teeth. One factor that comes into play many times when making frames and cutting on a tablesaw is the quality of the saw and the blade. if there is runout in the arbor of the saw then this can show up in the cuts. same goes for blades. If warped it transfers to the cuts. Good luck Slowly trying to gather the tools I think will need. Didn't add a fence at the front because it will not only add more weight but would be useless one the blade passes through it because it can't be dropped on from the top and clear the blade and riving knife. OCtoolguy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTTHECLOCKMAN Posted June 10 Report Share Posted June 10 13 minutes ago, jimmyG said: Slowly trying to gather the tools I think will need. Didn't add a fence at the front because it will not only add more weight but would be useless one the blade passes through it because it can't be dropped on from the top and clear the blade and riving knife. That is basically not true. The fence is not really a fence but a support block of some sort that keeps both halves of the plywood flat. With a sled as you show the plywood can warp ever so slightly up on one side of the cut and will throw the cut off. The support can be any height you want so that you do not cut through it. Many people make this about 4" high. As far as weight well I can not answer that. We are talking a couple ounces. The riving knife is no thicker than the thinnest blade you are using. Yes you can not use a blade guard but that should not be a problem. I have no blade guard on mine since I got the saw. I use too many different type sleds that the guard gets in the way and is not useful . Safety is amplified with the use of sleds and hold down clamps. I would suggest hold downs clamps as well. This keeps the pieces being cut from creeping up on the blade and you push through. Any slight movement gets amplified with each cut. Again the most important part of doing a frame with 45 degrees is the exact same lengths on the parallel sides. again good luck. OCtoolguy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmyG Posted June 10 Author Report Share Posted June 10 6 hours ago, JTTHECLOCKMAN said: That is basically not true. The fence is not really a fence but a support block of some sort that keeps both halves of the plywood flat. With a sled as you show the plywood can warp ever so slightly up on one side of the cut and will throw the cut off. The support can be any height you want so that you do not cut through it. Many people make this about 4" high. As far as weight well I can not answer that. We are talking a couple ounces. The riving knife is no thicker than the thinnest blade you are using. Yes you can not use a blade guard but that should not be a problem. I have no blade guard on mine since I got the saw. I use too many different type sleds that the guard gets in the way and is not useful . Safety is amplified with the use of sleds and hold down clamps. I would suggest hold downs clamps as well. This keeps the pieces being cut from creeping up on the blade and you push through. Any slight movement gets amplified with each cut. Again the most important part of doing a frame with 45 degrees is the exact same lengths on the parallel sides. again good luck. Made a back fence today... Didn't need to be as high as I made it since it will only be used for picture frame but I figured what the heck... OCtoolguy, danny and JTTHECLOCKMAN 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wichman Posted June 10 Report Share Posted June 10 (edited) I've used this style before, but I can't find mine right now. Just an idea for an alternative style of sled. All of the saws in the commercial framing business I worked at had a adjustable stop that featured a reverse 45* bevel that formed a pocket to fit the frame into so that the frame wouldn't be able to creep. the style I referred to: https://www.amazon.com/Rockler-45-Degree-Miter-Sled/dp/B0186IPNCM/ref=pd_ybh_a_d_sccl_1/141-1356443-9605339?pd_rd_w=DmW1Q&content-id=amzn1.sym.67f8cf21-ade4-4299-b433-69e404eeecf1&pf_rd_p=67f8cf21-ade4-4299-b433-69e404eeecf1&pf_rd_r=0AH64H39YPK30EM0Y3RP&pd_rd_wg=Gj9Sf&pd_rd_r=a653147f-a65d-448d-8db7-0380c8172cb6&pd_rd_i=B0186IPNCM&psc=1 Edited June 10 by Wichman OCtoolguy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmyG Posted June 14 Author Report Share Posted June 14 I've watched plenty of videos on how to CUT miters for picture frames but very few that explain the math to show WHERE to cut them except the ones that engineering majors post. So I guess coming up with a simple EASY to follow formula to make a frame for a 1/4" panel with NO mat remains a mystery. Most of my woodworking skills have been trial and error anyway... OCtoolguy and barb.j.enders 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill WIlson Posted June 14 Report Share Posted June 14 In simplest terms the short point of your miter will be the length of the corresponding edge of the piece being framed, less 2x the width of the rabbet. If the dimensions of the piece are 10" x 12" and the rabbet is 1/2" wide, then the short point of the miter for 2 sides would be 9" and 11" for the other 2 sides. Cut them a hair long and sneak up on a final dimension for best fit, if you aren't comfortable committing to a finished dimension with the first cut. Always make sure to cut pieces for parallel sides to exactly the same dimension. OCtoolguy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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